Re- babbitting a barring.

[DanMartin]

I'm totally facinated by this thread. I know next-to-nothing about the engine in question (other than what is in this thread), but let me humbly offer this:

Maybe a dry-sump system? Plenty of off-the-shelf belt-driven pumps out there complete with air separators and multi-stage pump mechanisms. Just block off the existing pump and shaft, plumb in an intake into the pan somewhere, and plumb the externally-driven pump into where the old pump's high-pressure oil went. You can that high-pressure oil through a good filter before it goes to the engine (like a modern engine)...just make sure it's got a pressure bypass for those cold starts (or run a really good low-weight synthetic oil).

You can also hook up an pressure alarm on the pump or a switch to ensure that ignition is cut if the pump fails (or belt breaks or something). This is pretty typical on any modern engine (lose oil pressure and the fuel pump turns off usually, except when cranking or shortly after).

A touch of modern tech can keep that old motor going for years-n-years for minimal effort IMO. Anyways...something to consider.

 

[madsam]

Thanks. I have been trying to do a lot of pics. The engine had an old style low pressure oil alarm, which works, but the brain trusts running it ignored the alarm... But I probably could not have gotten the thing if they had not done that. The old alarm used a pressure gage with an adjustable screw set to about 10psi. when the needle falls to 10psi it hits the screw and sets off the alarm. (1962 technology..) The truck engine has oil filters as it is a International gas truck engine from the 60s. This big engine was mainly designed in 1927, but has been updated a little. Just not the oil filter or air filter part.

I pulled out the spark plugs in those 2 cylinders so I could insert the piston from the bottom. I tried with my make shift ring compressor but the thing was not strong enough or was unstable at that size. (6 inches). So I took a ratchet tie down strap and ran it through the other rod barring hole in the rod and connected the ends up in the engine. ( I will get a pick tomorrow on the other rod.) This put a positive pressure on the piston to go back into the cylinder. Then I used my fingers to push the 3/8 inch tall rings, 4 of them, into the grove on the piston until the whole ring was inside the cylinder. The piston went pop and then I tightened the strap to push to the nest ring. After standing under the truck and fighting for about an hour, I got one piston in and did not crack any rings.

So I will do the other tomorrow now that I know how to do it.

Here is a pic of the bid spark plug in that thing. There is 2 plugs per cylinder. It is a champion W-14. Notice my fingers for size. It looks like I can still buy them for about 6$ a pop..

 

[WillWagner]

Hey madsam, How about smoething like this? The holes in the pan can be easily tapped for pipe and sealed and there would be minimal or no permanent mods to the lube pump. I know it might cavitate, but just don't load the engine and keep the RPM down and keep it in line only long enough to let the engine circulate the oil a couple of times. This way, the pump won't get the floaties into the gears.

 

[madsam]

That is a nice idea. Did I mention the oil pan is cast iron.. Yes, I can drill and tap it. I can't use the engine at low rpm though. the thing is governed for rpm. It has to be ready to blow snow soon.

But maybe if I put a pump between the filter and the pickup it would not cavitate. I don't think that there would be a problem to have 2 pumps.

 

[madsam]

OK, tried at lunch to insert the piston, but some how the engine block has snagged the compression ring. I have pic. I have tried to get it to let go, but I don't want to brake the ring. Here is pict on the strap insertion idea. I also have pics of the low oil and high temp alarms.

 

[madsam]

After looking at the pics, I wonder if I 'un-screw' the ring. Maybe it slid over something on the block that I can't see. (My head only goes so far into the engine..245223.jpg)

EDIT- OK, that worked. I was able to unscrew it out... More to come.

 

[madsam]

Ok, I have all pistons in the cylinders now. This next weekend I will hook the connecting rods to the crank and maybe finish this long engine processes.

 

[madsam]

Tried to work on the thing a little yesterday when it was below freezing. I can't seem to turn the crank now. I think that there might be some watter in the barrings from when the oil and watter mixed and it might be froze now.. I was thinking that I might put a tarp over and put a propane heater to heat up the whole big engine.

Any ideas?

 

[madsam]

Ok, the problem with the crank turning in the engine was that the little amounts of water in the oil in the barrings froze and expanded stopping the crank. This was not antifreeze, it was water from the rain. The problem is how do I warm up a 15,000lb 6 foot long engine outside in the 9 degree weather every night. Well, I bar-b-qued it. I took the grill and put it under the truck, which is tall and has the oil pan off so the heat went directly to the crank. It has to be a warm day, 40.) I also took a propane torch and carefully ran it on all the bearings. After about an hour, I was able to turn the crank again. It seems smooth, and no grinding. I have all journals hooked up except 1. That will have to be next weekend. I hope to get it running then.

 

[madsam]

I finally go the thing back together today, but it will not fire. I did not change any timing. It is getting gas, It builds up oil pressure. I turns over smooth. I even tried to use starting fluid. No pop. I have some new plugs. It is like the 2 ignitions aren't getting power. It got to cold and dark to play with, but I will look at it tomorrow.

 

[zak]

Your very captive audience would die for a short video with sound when you get it up and running!

 

[maxim]

Here is some insight to babbit bearing restoration.

http://www.antiqueenginerebuilding.com/

 

[Stretch44875]

Really need video of you carving a 10 foot drift with that monster. Sounds like it will be running soon.

Dennis

 

[madsam]

Ok, you know how God has a sense of humor. I had not gotten it running yet. All back to gather yesterday and I was weighting for today when it was warmer to start it... It was not warmer and snowing. I now have 1ft of fresh snow and no machine to move it yet.

 

[madsam]

I worked on it a little today. Tried to start her up. No fire. I had replaced all the plugs on both sides. The drivers side is the coil distributer side, and the passenger is the magneto side. Well, apparently neither side is firing. Looks like an electrical issue. No voltage at the coil with ignition on. The strange thing is that the rear motor works on a -12V.. Not +12v. The positive of the battery is hooked to to the frame. I thought the magneto would fire without a battery, at least that is the info I get. I tried to see if the plugs were fowled, and they looked good. So I shot starter fluid into the cylinders then lit it to burn off excess fuel.. Well, my suggestion is to not have your face directly in front of the plug hole. My eyebrows are a little shorter now. (I forgot that a 7X6 bore can hold a lot of fuel... ) If it does not snow to much tonight, I will trace down the power issue.

 

[zak]

opcorn:

 

[madsam]

Sorry, I work in Denver 3 days a week. So I have not gotten back to this. This weekend. (I hope, as long as no more snow..) I wish I had the parts in the summer so I could have finished when it was warm. It sits now that the wire to the coil seems to be bad. no voltage on the coil end.

 

[madsam]

Well, tried today. To cold, and even heated the engine and charged the batt. the engine will not turn over very fast. Thinking on hooking one of my 816 batts in parallel. It won't fire if it has no speed.. Even tried started flewit. Thought that might make it pop.

Any one ever done a trick on starting any big - cold - engine?

 

[JasonS]

I've got a manual for the 1150 cubic inch Waukesha WAKD diesel engine and they did some interesting things to get it started in very cold weather:

The manual stated that 30W oil at -30F (quite a combination!), may require more than three times the torque than the engine is available to develop to overcome friction and maintain running. Further, it states that this may occur in spite of prolonged preheating of the block with the pony engine and notwithstanding that the heads and intake manifold may be uncomfortable to touch. To remedy this, the 30W oil was drained out after shutting down and replaced with 10W oil and run for a short time to distribute the lighter oil. The next cold start was then easier. The 10W was drained out after reaching 100F and replaced with 30W.

 

[WillWagner]

Any way of adding a coolant heater?