Recommendations - FLU419 review for purchase ?

[MaybeA419]

Especially if it hasn't been used for a while, be sure to clean off the rods on all hydraulic cylinders before trying to operate the loader or backhoe.
I liked buying the ones listed as non-runners as the seals were still intact, and it was usually easy to get them started.

Also, it sounds like you haven't read the "Owners" thread yet. If it can go wrong, or be repaired, I think everything has been brought up there.
And at least once.

Thanks for mentioning the rods. I noticed a bit of tiny rust pitting on the bucket and dipper cylinders. But was able to rub it off with my fingers, so (I think) their still OK.

I have started reading the 'Owners' thread (about first 15 pages), thanks for noting this. I've been splitting my time between the manuals and online research . There is a ton of info available, but finding it can be a challenge. Pretty much the same for parts.

 

[peakbagger]

Yes its a flaw in the design. Mercedes didnt install an air dryer on this series and the engine compressor can dump a lot of water into the air system. The spit valve on the pressure regulator isnt very large so water can get carried over to the crossover pipe and its a relative low point and gets trapped. The newer models like my 1300 have an air dryer that solves the moisture issue. I have one to install but its harder on the 406 SEE chassis than it is on the 1300.

Water can still build up in the crossover line but it doesnt rot the inside of the line out so any water eventually makes it to the air tanks. If you pull the plugs on air tanks, no doubt you will find lots of crunchy bits of rust and the crunchy bits also ends up in the third air bleeder that sits between the two air tanks. I also had crap in the spillover valves between the tanks. BTW if you ever plan to run the SEE in below freezing conditions, you need to make sure the alcohol injection system is operational (many arent due to design flaw associated with alcohol reservoir) and make sure you keep it full and turned on to keep the air system from freezing up.

 

[MaybeA419]

Yes its a flaw in the design. Mercedes didnt install an air dryer on this series and the engine compressor can dump a lot of water into the air system. The spit valve on the pressure regulator isnt very large so water can get carried over to the crossover pipe and its a relative low point and gets trapped. The newer models like my 1300 have an air dryer that solves the moisture issue. I have one to install but its harder on the 406 SEE chassis than it is on the 1300.

Water can still build up in the crossover line but it doesnt rot the inside of the line out so any water eventually makes it to the air tanks. If you pull the plugs on air tanks, no doubt you will find lots of crunchy bits of rust and the crunchy bits also ends up in the third air bleeder that sits between the two air tanks. I also had crap in the spillover valves between the tanks. BTW if you ever plan to run the SEE in below freezing conditions, you need to make sure the alcohol injection system is operational (many arent due to design flaw associated with alcohol reservoir) and make sure you keep it full and turned on to keep the air system from freezing up.

I did a quick check of the alcohol reservoir and delivery valve. Both appears (external review only) in good shape. The valve actually looked fairly new. I'm planning on checking the air tanks and (as you noted) expect very rusty water. Two quick questions. 1) Are there any components in the air system that are either hard to get and/or very expensive (excluding the pump). 2) What would be the impact of cross over line failure during driving? My understanding is the air system supports shifting in addition to braking, Again, thank you (and everyone else) for the incredible assistance.

 

[The FLU farm]

You can still shift, but the splitter won't work. Brakes will lose power assist, and 4WD and diff locks won't work.

I know it says not to drive before the air system is at pressure or damage can/will result, but I have yet to figure out what that damage could be.

 

[peakbagger]

I did a quick check of the alcohol reservoir and delivery valve. Both appears (external review only) in good shape. The valve actually looked fairly new. I'm planning on checking the air tanks and (as you noted) expect very rusty water. Two quick questions. 1) Are there any components in the air system that are either hard to get and/or very expensive (excluding the pump). 2) What would be the impact of cross over line failure during driving? My understanding is the air system supports shifting in addition to braking, Again, thank you (and everyone else) for the incredible assistance.

Yes there are many hard to get at components up around the transmission that may require a cab tilt. I haven't bought any and guess is most of the crap in the air line stays down low near the air tanks. The brake booster is $1,000 bucks plus or minus a few hundred. They are available but seem to be made out of unobtainium. They in theory can be rebuilt if they are not rotted out by recoating them with special coating normally used for electrical varnishing.

I lost my air system this summer while working remotely and had to drive home minus air assist. It was an interesting 30 minute very slow drive. The brakes are nearly non functional except for the emergency brake that works on the rear calipers. Despite really pulling hard on the ebrake its takes along time to slow down a 16k vehicle. The engine runs fine without air and everything on the tranny except the air shifter works without air. The 4WD and diff locks also do not work and the remote throttle for the backhoe. I did a lot of downshifting and ran in the breakdown lane. I cant tell you what was wrong but when I took the system partially apart I got air pressure back. I still need to take it apart again as I think I have a valve in backwards. I dont think my trailer brake air system works.

 

[MaybeA419]

You can still shift, but the splitter won't work. Brakes will lose power assist, and 4WD and diff locks won't work.

I know it says not to drive before the air system is at pressure or damage can/will result, but I have yet to figure out what that damage could be.

OK, thank you, I suspected all shifting would be interrupted/frozen. I was pretty sure brakes would be affected, suspecting it would trigger low air alarm and possibly lock brakes. I didn't think 4WD would be affected, but figured lockers wouldn't work. I'm glad I asked as it looks like my guesses were more wrong than right.

 

[MaybeA419]

Yes there are many hard to get at components up around the transmission that may require a cab tilt. I haven't bought any and guess is most of the crap in the air line stays down low near the air tanks. The brake booster is $1,000 bucks plus or minus a few hundred. They are available but seem to be made out of unobtainium. They in theory can be rebuilt if they are not rotted out by recoating them with special coating normally used for electrical varnishing.

I lost my air system this summer while working remotely and had to drive home minus air assist. It was an interesting 30 minute very slow drive. The brakes are nearly non functional except for the emergency brake that works on the rear calipers. Despite really pulling hard on the ebrake its takes along time to slow down a 16k vehicle. The engine runs fine without air and everything on the tranny except the air shifter works without air. The 4WD and diff locks also do not work and the remote throttle for the backhoe. I did a lot of downshifting and ran in the breakdown lane. I cant tell you what was wrong but when I took the system partially apart I got air pressure back. I still need to take it apart again as I think I have a valve in backwards. I dont think my trailer brake air system works.

Based on previous comments you've made I did price brake boosters (as you noted at roughly 1k). Ouch, I'm sorry to hear you lost your air, but your experience is exactly what I was pondering. I recently lost rear brakes on one of my passenger trucks and that emergency brake saved my rear, which Ironically I had just fixed the e-brake about 6 months ago. That was scary enough in a 4,500 pound small rig. Having this happen on a 16k truck rolling down the road at 40 or 50 MPH I can't even imagination. Didn't expect 4WD to affected, but figured lockers would be useless. So going back to your original post, the air system is 'critical' and should be kept in excellent condition. When going over a 419 for purchase, the air system is at the top of the list.

 

[Speedwoble]

OK, thank you, I suspected all shifting would be interrupted/frozen. I was pretty sure brakes would be affected, suspecting it would trigger low air alarm and possibly lock brakes. I didn't think 4WD would be affected, but figured lockers wouldn't work. I'm glad I asked as it looks like my guesses were more wrong than right.

The brakes on the FLU are air assist hydraulic. So without air, the brakes will work, poorly. Also, in normal driving, shifting will not be affected. The splitter is pneumatic, but used rarely.

 

[peakbagger]

I routinely move my SEE with the air pressure below its low setpoint with the master alarm light on. I am usually backing it out of its parking space and going quite slow and am not using the brakes a lot until the pressure is coming up. As I mentioned I have at least one known leak on my air lines and the SEE may sit for long periods between use so I am usually starting with zero air pressure. I do know that on my long slow drive home the pedal went all the way down to the floor with little brake effect. Once I got the air system to work again when home the brakes came back to act like normal.

My 1300 does not allow this as it has air actuated emergency brakes, until the air pressure comes up and releases the E brakes I am not going anywhere unless I activate an emergency override by crawling underneath and hitting the air cylinders with hammer.

One thing the OP just mentioned is driving at 40 to 50 MPH. Barring a billboard smooth road, 40 to 50 MPH may be an aspirational goal but most but not all owners probably have had their fill at 30 to 40 MPH especially with the stock Michelin's. With mine, anything over 30 would start to be a problem bumps across the road would start a front to back pitching while a crowned road could start a side to side pitching. I attribute both to a short wheelbase with a big weight suspended off the front end. I did switch to Pirelli Pistas which are more of an on road tire and on my long drive over to the site prior to my air loss I did perceive some improvement in handling but didnt push it. The other issue with mine is it just runs out of power on grades. I live on steep hill on state highway equipped with run away truck ramp. When heading home and heading up the hill, I am in second gear at full throttle going 15 MPH by the time I reach my turn off. On moderate grades even 30 MPH is a challenge. The SEE may have adequate torque and lots of gearing but a typical econobox has more horsepower. 16K with 100 HP does not equate to high speed up hills.

 

[Todd73130]

I sell a premade Stainless steel cross air line for $150shipped. I got them custom made by a local supplier. I have 3 left and do not plan on making more.

I need one of these air lines if you still have some.

 

[glcaines]

I need one of these air lines if you still have some.

I would recommend that you send him a PM with the question.

 

[Todd73130]

I would recommend that you send him a PM with the question.

I’m a bit ignorant as to how to do this.

 

[Todd73130]

I would recommend that you send him a PM with the question.

I tried to start a conversation without success.

 

[Mullaney]

I tried to start a conversation without success.

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You will need help from @patracy to send a PM message.
Limitation is in place to avoid spammers...

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