Starter issues

[paramilusmc]

So starter went today. While taking it off to bring it in for a rebuild I noticed allot of oil around the work area. Reason it went was a bolt fell out (kind of surprising) and when I went to try and turn it over the starter twisted and broke off a portion of the starter housing and wouldn't engage. Also found some pieces in the starter which I am sure did not help.

Thought I had it figured out, then the rebuild company called and they let me know that they found allot of oil inside the starter itself and it needed allot of work to rebuild.

She told me she could:

Rebuild the old 27MT 1998454 starter for $225.00
or
Replace it with a newer 28MT Delco 10461453 starter for $197.00 and stated it would be a heavier duty starter.

She stated that both were dry clutch starters and oil should have not been present inside. She said that wet clutch starters have a seal within that prevents oil from getting in.

So have I had the wrong starter and its just been a champ? Or should this have been a wet clutch starter?

Do I have bigger issues like a bad rear main seal and that's why oil is getting everywhere?

What do you guys think?

 

[cucvrus]

You have an oil leak probably from the rear main seal. And you did have the correct starter on the truck. That direct drive starter will crank all day and is very forgiving when it comes to heat. You have a choice to make. Spend the extra money and stay with the direct drive starter and make sure the stater support bracket is in place which ever choice you make.

 

[paramilusmc]

I was hoping that wasn't the case.

Anyone done a rear main seal on one of these ole girls? How much is that going to set me back?

 

[cpf240]

Have you checked the CDR valve? If it is bad, an over-pressure condition can occur in the crankcase, pushing oil past the rear main seal.

The seal probably needs to be replaced in any case, just wanted to cover all the bases. Hmm... on that note, could it have been diesel? The valley drains through the bell housing, and if the drain hole at the bottom was plugged, perhaps that could lead to fluid in the starter? Does your IP leak at all, perhaps at the throttle shaft?

 

[paramilusmc]

Have you checked the CDR valve? If it is bad, an over-pressure condition can occur in the crankcase, pushing oil past the rear main seal.

The seal probably needs to be replaced in any case, just wanted to cover all the bases. Hmm... on that note, could it have been diesel? The valley drains through the bell housing, and if the drain hole at the bottom was plugged, perhaps that could lead to fluid in the starter? Does your IP leak at all, perhaps at the throttle shaft?

Ok, I need some education.

CDR?

IP?

Having just pulled the starter off myself, yes very certain it is oil. In matter of fact I am all but certain that the oil is what lubed the starter bolts and enabled the vibration and torque from starting to work them loose. For the past couple of months I have been getting that puff of smoke that is an indicator of the rear seal.

 

[cpf240]

Ok, I need some education.

CDR?

IP?

Having just pulled the starter off myself, yes very certain it is oil. In matter of fact I am all but certain that the oil is what lubed the starter bolts and enabled the vibration and torque from starting to work them loose. For the past couple of months I have been getting that puff of smoke that is an indicator of the rear seal.

CDR = tuna can looking thing on the right side valve cover, regulates air pressure in the crankcase, sort of like a PCV valve but not the same
IP = Injection pump

I'm thinking that it would take a lot of oil buildup in the bell housing to make it into the starter, and would also think it would drip out of the drain hole at the bottom of the bell housing first, but I could be wrong on that.

 

[paramilusmc]

Very good points. Gives me something to think about.

 

[paramilusmc]

Well, got the starter rebuilt and went to put it on. What I additionally found was that the bolt didn't fall out. It broke off up inside the bell housing. Not sure what would cause that condition, but I decided that wasn't work I had time to perform.

Also had them take the hubs apart and replace the front wheel bearings. it was time.

 

[doghead]

Was the support bracket missing?

Without one, the bolts will break.

 

[cucvrus]

This is another place were I never reuse the bolts. It is not worth the effort. The bolts that I have are designed with lock tight on the threads. Once I remove the starter bolts I discard them and put new ones in place. The starter support bracket is the critical key to the starter staying intact. The support bracket must be in place and tight. The block hole is an M8 1.25 X 19mm and the starter stud is 1/4 X 20. I use a flanged nylock on that sud. That is the same nylocks are a once and done fastener. These are my real world experiences. I never had any broken starter bolts that I caused. I have custom fabbed support brackets for the OEM direct drive starter if you need them. They are listed in the classifieds. Have a good day and good luck.