What have you done to your HMMWV today/lately

[gtodan]

24v to 12v converter?

Anyone know if it's possible to install a 12v winch by drawing power off the dual volt alternator? Or if there are other options? 24v winches are crazy expensive.

 

[911joeblow]

Anyone know if it's possible to install a 12v winch by drawing power off the dual volt alternator? Or if there are other options? 24v winches are crazy expensive.

Just run it at 24V. It will run twice as fast and use 1/2 the amps. Very common for the pro off roaders to do just that.

 

[ryanruck]

Anyone know if it's possible to install a 12v winch by drawing power off the dual volt alternator? Or if there are other options? 24v winches are crazy expensive.

I have a commercial 12v Badlands winch installed in my truck.

First, there is no 24v-12v converter powerful enough to handle the draw of an electric winch.

The 14v tap on the regulator may only output 50A but with the generous capacity of the Hawker batteries, I don't believe I'd be able to seriously drain it assuming normal use. I haven't crunched the numbers to verify this for sure but I'm sure someone could if they're so inclined. If you're running standard civi grade batteries, this setup may not be a good idea.

I have verified the winch works and have done some limited pulls with it but I definitely have not put it through its paces.

I've decided if I have any issues with drain or charging, I'm going to do one of two things:

1) Replace the relays with 24v relays and run the motor at 24v. This will make the winch run faster and can decrease life but at the end of the day it's just a cheap Badlands winch.
2) Install an H1 underhood battery tray and parallel in two additional 12v AGMs to the rear battery for a huge increase in 12v capacity.

Option 1 has the benefit of being cheaper and easier and option 2, while being more expensive (the H1 battery tray alone is about $350), would make a very nice addition to the truck.

There's also something else to keep in mind with a commercial winch. Most commercial winches have a 4"x10" mounting bolt pattern while military ones seem to have a 4"x9" (from the winch bumpers I've run across) so, to use the regular HMMWV winch bumpers, you'll have to elongate the mounting holes to accommodate the commercial winch.

ETA: I also had to reclock the winch. There's instructions out there on doing this with a winch if you search "reclock winch".

 

[Bobthebuilder]

Thanks for the advice guys!

 

[M1097A2NUT]

Anyone know if it's possible to install a 12v winch by drawing power off the dual volt alternator? Or if there are other options? 24v winches are crazy expensive.

Yes you can run a 12v winch. You need to run a minimum of a 4 gauge charging cable from the 14v tap on the alternator to the positive terminal of the rear battery first. Then you will connect the positive cable from the winch to the positive terminal of the rear battery as well. This will keep your batteries in balance.

 

[Augi]

Is there a separate wire harness for the solenoids? Hook the motor with the fat cable to the 24v system (generally they go to the positive lug on the starter) and use 12v from the top of the lower battery to drive the 12v solenoids. They will all share the common ground.

Augi

 

[ryanruck]

Is there a separate wire harness for the solenoids? Hook the motor with the fat cable to the 24v system (generally they go to the positive lug on the starter) and use 12v from the top of the lower battery to drive the 12v solenoids. They will all share the common ground.

Augi

Here's the manual for the Badland 12k. Page 9 has the wiring setup. The winch has 1 big positive input however, without having the open solenoid box in front of me, I'm betting you probably could split it up the way you're talking about.

 

[donkren]

My niehoff alternator 1225-1 is rated for 50A output on the 12V terminal. That should be enought to compensate for occasional use of an electric winch, unless you have significant other 12V loads.. The brunt of the work will be done by the battery. The 6T batteries in a HMMWV are pretty hefty, but very expensive, so you don't want to abuse them. I'd think they would also support occasional use of a winch, but you are putting the (considerable) load on just one battery, definitely not ideal. If I had a 12V winch on hand, I wouldn't be afraid to try it. That said, I haven't done it myself. Definitely a 24V winch would be a much better alternative. The preferred setup if you'll be doing a lot of winching, seems to be a hydraulic winch, driven off the power steering pump. Perhaps you can find a surplus one near you. The Army used a 10,500# mile marker hydraulic.

Here is a link to a good source of basic battery info: http://www.pulsetech.net/media/wysiwyg/Pulsetech/etc/PPC-BMMP-May-2014.pdf

 

[NormB]

Saturday, May 6 I removed the parking brake and shifter "box". Rubber was a little dry on both. I got a "new" style parking brake lever - latching type - installed with some help from my son who hadn't used any air tools yet so it was a "bonding" experience. Getting everything OUT? No problem, just used a couple of visegrips underneath and the air tool inside the cab, EZPZ.

Dismantled shifter box, cleaned, lubed mechanicals, replaced rubber seals/boot (was torn), had to put a new cover over one male boot for wiring harness (I bought a couple dozen of these off ePay last fall when I first got the truck so I have "spares"), lubed most everything up good with dielectric paste (the pricey kind - Dow Corning 4), put in 1/4-20 rivnuts on the tunnel for ease of (hopefully) never having to remove this again.

I broke the roll pin on the T/C shifter just trying to unscrew the knob (it does come off, doesn't it?), no clue what material the shifter arm is made of, but I had to clamp it on my mill and bore out the pin from arm AND frame/fork with a 3mm flat cutter. Used a 1/8 roll pin from a box of AR15 spares (trigger guard plate) a little aluminum HVAC tape around the end of the shifter arm to take up some slack and tapped the new roll pin home.

Then I replaced the forward U-joint on the propeller shaft in prep for reassembling the T/C.

Somewhere before I got all that started I went to Advance auto for some threadlocker an the post office.

Oh, and laundry.

Pretty productive day, I think.

 

[74M35A2]

12v HF off the first battery is lowest cost way. Running a 12v on 24v will only work for a short while till cooked. Why don't you guys pick up a used MileMarker 10k 2 speed hydraulic winch that some of these had on them? I bought one and it is strong as an OK. Runs off the power steering pump, and works underwater. 100% duty cycle. I'll sell it if somebody really wants it, I have it on the front of a rollback tow truck I am about to sell.

 

[Mario]

I have a commercial 12v Badlands winch installed in my truck.

First, there is no 24v-12v converter powerful enough to handle the draw of an electric winch.

The 14v tap on the regulator may only output 50A but with the generous capacity of the Hawker batteries, I don't believe I'd be able to seriously drain it assuming normal use. I haven't crunched the numbers to verify this for sure but I'm sure someone could if they're so inclined. If you're running standard civi grade batteries, this setup may not be a good idea.

I have verified the winch works and have done some limited pulls with it but I definitely have not put it through its paces.

I've decided if I have any issues with drain or charging, I'm going to do one of two things:

1) Replace the relays with 24v relays and run the motor at 24v. This will make the winch run faster and can decrease life but at the end of the day it's just a cheap Badlands winch.
2) Install an H1 underhood battery tray and parallel in two additional 12v AGMs to the rear battery for a huge increase in 12v capacity.

Option 1 has the benefit of being cheaper and easier and option 2, while being more expensive (the H1 battery tray alone is about $350), would make a very nice addition to the truck.

There's also something else to keep in mind with a commercial winch. Most commercial winches have a 4"x10" mounting bolt pattern while military ones seem to have a 4"x9" (from the winch bumpers I've run across) so, to use the regular HMMWV winch bumpers, you'll have to elongate the mounting holes to accommodate the commercial winch.

ETA: I also had to reclock the winch. There's instructions out there on doing this with a winch if you search "reclock winch".

What do you mean when you say "commercial winch"?
I just got this 12,000lbs one https://m.harborfreight.com/12000-l...-with-automatic-load-holding-brake-61256.html
If I can just run it at 24VDC that would be awesome.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

 

[Mario]

12v HF off the first battery is lowest cost way. Running a 12v on 24v will only work for a short while till cooked. Why don't you guys pick up a used MileMarker 10k 2 speed hydraulic winch that some of these had on them? I bought one and it is strong as an OK. Runs off the power steering pump, and works underwater. 100% duty cycle. I'll sell it if somebody really wants it, I have it on the front of a rollback tow truck I am about to sell.

For me it's the cost.
I've seen them go for $1,000 or more on fleabay.
I got 12k one from hazard freight with an intention of putting it on receiver plate and having ability to move it between front and rear.
When not in use, she'll be stored in the truck's bed, over the wheel well -- at least that's the plan for now.

If you're selling yours and price is right, I'll take it.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

 

[ryanruck]

What do you mean when you say "commercial winch"?
I just got this 12,000lbs one https://m.harborfreight.com/12000-l...-with-automatic-load-holding-brake-61256.html
If I can just run it at 24VDC that would be awesome.

Sent from my SM-G920P using Tapatalk

Just in reference to a standard, off-the-shelf 12v winch versus one designed for military use or these trucks specifically.

I have the exact same winch. I'm running mine off 12v so I can't offer any first hand experience with converting or rewiring it. If you want to run it off 24v you'll need to either rewire it so the winch motor feed is 24v and the solenoid control is tapped into 12v as Augi suggested or, replace the solenoid with a compatible 24v one and run the whole thing off 24v. As was mentioned in either scenario the drum will run faster and the winch motor could have a reduced lifespan.

Here's some internal pics of the Badlands solenoid box on a Wrangler forum. As you can see from the pic, that small red wire that's tapped into the heavy gauge wire should be where they're getting their solenoid control power from. Not having a wiring diagram, I would meter it out to verify though. Following Augi's advice, you should be able to wire that small wire to your 12v and then the heavy gauge wire to your 24v.

 

[911joeblow]

I have run 12V winches on 24v for years. I have also run 12V on 12V and 24V on 24V. I have also changed solenoids on both 12V and 24V winches and one thing I have started to see is that many winches now use the same solenoid whether 12v or 24v. In any case I usually upgrade to solid state anyway when I change them and those are 6V to 32V range in one unit and bullet proof. Again I am telling you that 12V winches will and do work on 24V, and work well. They run much faster and thusly reduce the pull time needed. They do get hotter but it is a wash as at 12v it will get just as hot after taking twice as long to winch. This is a common thing for the pros to do since time is a big deal.

 

[Mario]

I have run 12V winches on 24v for years. I have also run 12V on 12V and 24V on 24V. I have also changed solenoids on both 12V and 24V winches and one thing I have started to see is that many winches now use the same solenoid whether 12v or 24v. In any case I usually upgrade to solid state anyway when I change them and those are 6V to 32V range in one unit and bullet proof. Again I am telling you that 12V winches will and do work on 24V, and work well. They run much faster and thusly reduce the pull time needed. They do get hotter but it is a wash as at 12v it will get just as hot after taking twice as long to winch. This is a common thing for the pros to do since time is a big deal.

Awesome. I would like to try to run it with 24V for the simplicity. Do you have part numbers/source for the solid state relays that you use?

 

[911joeblow]

Awesome. I would like to try to run it with 24V for the simplicity. Do you have part numbers/source for the solid state relays that you use?

Just look for golf cart SS solenoids. They go up to 32v or 36V or so, but 24V is fine. They are like $50 each. Golf cart supply places have them.

 

[74M35A2]

If you cut the rated duty cycle of a 12v winch down to 1/4 of its rating when using it on 24v, it will be fine. Ohm's law, V = I x R. R is fixed, and we are doubling V (voltage), so I (current) also doubles. W (watts) = I x V, so if it was initially a 3000W electric motor, it is now pulling 12,000W.

Very short duty cycles are OK, but the motor will heat much faster, the brushes/commutator melt (hottest part of the motor), the insulation melts off the wires, and it shorts out with a burning smell we all know. She'll do it, but she will get hot, and very quickly once under load. Splashing water on the motor case does not do very much to alleviate this. It will do it, but for how long is a gamble.

If you guys have ever used a hydraulic one, you would not want anything else. They can be had cheap, and run off the steering pump. MileMarker makes them, and they can be had for peanuts, used. Mount it on a small hitch plate, and have a receiver in front and rear of the truck, with some Bobcat type quick connect fittings on the steering pump hose. Their ability to work under water and 100% duty cycle is fabulous, plus they are impervious to rain and weather exposure, unlike an electric one.

If you have a 12v, just run it on 12v, the duty cycle is short enough already at that.

 

[infidel got me]

ecv hood is done- now on to hard doors!

 

[Wire Fox]

Yesterday, I had a chance to meet vitamink and check out his HMMWV. Didn't get the official nomenclature for it while I was there, but it looked like it was an M1025. Either way, it was a blast to just take it around the block and talk with him about what he's done with it so far and what he plans to do, which has got me re-hyped on my own HMMWV leading me to...

Today, I dropped off the propeller shafts with a local fleet drivetrain shop. They have the best-looking rate I've seen anywhere, so I'm hoping their work exceeds their pricing and they can get these back to me soon. Once I got home, I saw that UPS had left a present, which I promptly put to the test. I now have an MSD-ICE Test Kit. I inspected it and everything was present except for one positively standard, mundane serial cable. If I can't find one in my cable drawer (every serial cable I have so far is serial -> something unique), I'll shell out the $2 it takes to buy a "military"-looking serial cable. It should only be needed for the DPA, too. I was able to get the ICE Box hooked up to my HMMWV and it hooked up to my laptop and somehow enough software to install to get measurements back from the STE/ICE port. I'm really glad to see it working and seeing my voltage fluctuate, live! What I'm working on now with it will be getting the DPA connected, and getting the NI LabView suite working to be able to do more precision tests than what the IETM's automated tests provide.

 

[General Hood]

Yesterday, I had a chance to meet vitamink and check out his HMMWV. Didn't get the official nomenclature for it while I was there, but it looked like it was an M1025. Either way, it was a blast to just take it around the block and talk with him about what he's done with it so far and what he plans to do, which has got me re-hyped on my own HMMWV leading me to...

Today, I dropped off the propeller shafts with a local fleet drivetrain shop. They have the best-looking rate I've seen anywhere, so I'm hoping their work exceeds their pricing and they can get these back to me soon. Once I got home, I saw that UPS had left a present, which I promptly put to the test. I now have an MSD-ICE Test Kit. I inspected it and everything was present except for one positively standard, mundane serial cable. If I can't find one in my cable drawer (every serial cable I have so far is serial -> something unique), I'll shell out the $2 it takes to buy a "military"-looking serial cable. It should only be needed for the DPA, too. I was able to get the ICE Box hooked up to my HMMWV and it hooked up to my laptop and somehow enough software to install to get measurements back from the STE/ICE port. I'm really glad to see it working and seeing my voltage fluctuate, live! What I'm working on now with it will be getting the DPA connected, and getting the NI LabView suite working to be able to do more precision tests than what the IETM's automated tests provide.

You know we'll want to see progress photos.........