Winch Kit

[tx399999]

I'm completely new to winch operation and have been researching what gear I should have on hand. I've gone through FM 9-43-2 and TM 9-2320-361-10 but I'm sure there is more complete information here. My list so far is:

2 3"x10' tree protectors
2 1" shackles
2 6" snatch blocks
1 6"x30' recovery strap

Here Snatch Blocks is the source for snatch blocks that I am thinking about. I know that I'm missing something and would like to hear any additions or corrections to my list.

 

[Recovry4x4]

I think you should "up" the size of the tree straps. I'd also seriously consider having a wrecker chain. I lost mine and sure wish I could afford another one!

 

[gimpyrobb]

Your not too far from Sermis. Get your snatch blocks from him. You will not beat his prices.

 

[rumplecat]

Is this chain what you are talking about being a wrecker chain. I saw it yesterday hanging off a pickup bed as I was heading home from the Petit Jean MV show, the guy made me a package deal I couldn't refuse, this being laid off sucks, he had a super 1903 for $400 I couldn't swing.
On the chain how do you use the large loop, the chain is very heavy duty!
James G.

 

[KsM715]

rumplecat, what is that light guard off of? If it works for a M715 want to sell it?

If so I call first dibs on it!!

 

[rumplecat]

Sorry I have three 715s screaming for the black out light guard! The old guy had a pickup bed full of odds and ends parts he had cleaned out of a shed he had, the pistol and bayonet were from his closet! I would have gotten a couple of other interesting parts/small machines but I wasn't sure what they were off of and I am trying to economize.
James

 

[Recovry4x4]

That is sure similar to my old wrecker chain. Mine was about 12' and had the pears at each end and one grab hook. I think Timntrucks has them but I just can't swing it now with the GA rally coming up.

 

[rockman]

Chekc out Stretch's instructional winching video on You tube. It be a good reference...

 

[tx399999]

Thank' for the tips, Stretch's video is a great starting point.

 

[clinto]

Ok, I just swapped a winch onto my primary deuce and I am trying to put together a comprehensive "kit" of gear to take with me when we do the trails.

I wasn't sure which thread best covered this.......................

Maddawg started this thread: http://www.steelsoldiers.com/conversations/19896-what-bring-when-you-go-offroading-mv.html

But that thread seems to be more tailored towards not just the recovery gear, but what kind of spare parts you should take with you.

I am thinking one of Kenny's recommended 6"x30' straps, a few 2" and 4" straps, a few d-rings, tree savers, etc.

Before we go any further, an excellent description of straps here: http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/3382-new-us-mil-spec-tow-straps-cheap.html

Ok guys, what do the experts call for? I want a kit that will allow for self recovery, as well as the recovery of 5 tons, deuces, Jeeps, Land Rovers and Mules (mules don't float!).

 

[gimpyrobb]

No less than 2 snatch blocks.
3-6 or 8 inch wide tree savers.
2 or more 50' sections of wire rope.
You can bury a tire if there is nothing to attach your winch to.
4x6 cribbing is good to have too. Length is up to you, but 6-10ft is recommended.
Sandbags with handles for the winch cable. I know folks say a blanket, but the handles can be attached with a clevis or beaner.
Heavy gloves.
Shear pins.
Assorted clevises.

 

[m16ty]

You can bury a tire if there is nothing to attach your winch to.

How well does that hold?

 

[gimpyrobb]

The deeper you bury it, the better it works!

 

[Katahdin]

A guy I work with, that has experience with microwave antenna towers, suggested carrying a ground anchor that screws into the ground. Just spin it with a long pipe, breaker bar, etc.

Here's some I found with google:
Steel Earth Screw Ground Anchors | GME Supply | 800-940-6762 | GME Supply

 

[clinto]

No less than 2 snatch blocks.

Ok, I am good there. I have 2 of the correct deuce blocks that are NOS and an NOS block off the 5 ton (much bigger).

3-6 or 8 inch wide tree savers.

10' length seem reasonable? That's what Kenny recommended above. Or a short, medium and long assortment?

2 or more 50' sections of wire rope.

I assume the same 1/2" stuff that's on the deuce winch is sufficient? Since I am about to replace the winch cable on mine I can just get an extra 100'. How would you terminate it (see image "end terminations.jpg")?

You can bury a tire if there is nothing to attach your winch to.

Is a tire the better choice for an improvised anchor or just a "best bang for the buck" answer? I considered getting an anchor of some sort.

4x6 cribbing is good to have too. Length is up to you, but 6-10ft is recommended.

GTG here as well.

Sandbags with handles for the winch cable. I know folks say a blanket, but the handles can be attached with a clevis or beaner.

Good idea.

Heavy gloves/Shear pins.

GTG here as well. I have a box of pins along with clips/cotter pins to mount them and a correct sized punch to remove the remnants.

Assorted clevises.

Ok, let's talk clevis'. See image "shackle types.jpg". It seems the universal style is the screw pin anchor shackle. I've got a couple of big shackles in this style. How many are we talking? 2? 5? And can you recommend a manufacturer? I know the ebay/HF/Chinese stuff is trash and will explode easily, I wanna get the good stuff.

A guy I work with, that has experience with microwave antenna towers, suggested carrying a ground anchor that screws into the ground. Just spin it with a long pipe, breaker bar, etc.

Here's some I found with google:
Steel Earth Screw Ground Anchors | GME Supply | 800-940-6762 | GME Supply

You think those are sufficient? The largest one they have is only rated for 16K lbs.



Looking forward to other's opinions as well, thanks in advance.

C

 

[Katahdin]

You think those are sufficient? The largest one they have is only rated for 16K lbs.

I was using that link as an example of what it looks like, but in terms of rating I assume that's in upwards force. Me thinks it'll have more holding power if its anchored vertically and being pulled at horizontally. In any event, I hope I don't get that stuck.

Edit: you could also buy two and rig a snatch block between them, stagger them, etc.

 

[clinto]

Also, should we be carrying 2 types of recovery straps with us?

I thought that when you were going to "snatch" a stuck vehicle out, by getting a moving start on it, you had to use the correct "recovery" type straps that are designed to stretch and use kinetic energy to get the stuck vehicle out. And when you are in a situation where you're just going to slowly let the slack out, then just pull the stuck vehicle out, you'd use a normal "tow" type strap. This is what I thought, but according to this very good how-to guide on pirate, apparently that's not the case:

[FONT=Arial, Arial, Helvetica]DO NOT ever use tow ropes, tow straps, emergency tow ropes etc. These are designed only for easy flat road towing of a non-running vehicle (and are dubious for that, in my opinion) - not for the rigors of off-road extraction and recovery.[/FONT]

Link: Pirate4x4.Com - Extreme Four Wheel Drive

I was using that link as an example of what it looks like, but in terms of rating I assume that's in upwards force. Me thinks it'll have more holding power if its anchored vertically and being pulled at horizontally. In any event, I hope I don't get that stuck.

Edit: you could also buy two and rig a snatch block between them, stagger them, etc.

Gotcha. I'm with you.

 

[m16ty]

I'd probably just use cable clamps to make eye's on my "extensions". You could get all fancy with a Esomet type fitting (same as on the winch cable end) but the clamps will hold just as well, cheaper, and easier to assemble. You can forget the swaged type fitting unless you get them made up by somebody with a swaging machine (big press with correct dies).

I have seen people thread a eye in a piece of wire rope. They use a big steel needle a it's a art to it. I wouldn't attempt it myself because it looks like a real pain.

The wedge socket is mainly used where the end needs to be disassembled often. As in to add parts to a line or change boom in a crane. Not needed for winching operations as snatch blocks can be "opened" to pass the line through. It's also big and bulky compared to other methods.

Shackles are a personal preference. Stay away from the China stuff though. We use mostly Crosby brand at work but any good USA brand will be ok. Personally, I'd go with the screw pin shackle. Only two pieces to keep up with on a screw pin. The "screw pin anchor shackle" in your pic is the one made to work with wire rope (it will also work with chains).

One note on screw pin shackles. When you insert the pin, tighten the pin down then back it off a little (1/8 of a turn is more than enough). If you tighten the pin all the way and leave it tight 9 times out of 10 you'll have to use tools (crescent wrench or something) to loosen the pin after use. This is common practice in the rigging industry and you'll get your butt chewed out if you attach a shackle and need tools to remove it when you're finished with the lift.

 

[gimpyrobb]

The screw-in ground anchors are not my favorite, but do work. If you are in a sandy area, use 2 or 3 in a line, 6-10ft from each other, and connect them from hoop to hoop. Thats spreads out the amount of force trying to pull them out of the ground.

 

[m16ty]

I thought that when you were going to "snatch" a stuck vehicle out, by getting a moving start on it, you had to use the correct "recovery" type straps that are designed to stretch and use kinetic energy to get the stuck vehicle out.

I'm not real crazy about this method. Sure, we all get desperate at times and do it anyway but it's dangerous whatever strap you use. Wasn't there a recent post of somebody getting killed doing this? My thinking is that if you use one of those stretching recovery straps and the attachment point lets go, it's going to come at you at much more force than if you used a cable or tow strap. If you use the snatch method with a recovery strap make 200% sure that your attachment points and other rigging can hold up.