NTC 400 Mo Power

[Floridianson]

If moving more fuel is a concern would removing the EMR. shut down valve help?

 

[WillWagner]

Give ma an engine serial number and I can tell you what it is.

And the inner cylinders run hotter, 3 and 4 are the hottest. When the N14 was introduced the dual line set up was was used not for HP, but for cooling and to get rid of the air pocket that forms in the dead end passage after the #1 injector...remember, air compresses, fuel don't...that pocket never goes away. The little plastic stick plugs were also put into the late L10, M11 and ISM engines for the same air pocket reason. If you used a sensitive enough gauge, you can see the difference in pressure measurement between the single and dual feed set ups. The fuel actually pulses in the single feed as compared to a steady pressure in the dual feed.

If you like, I can get some part numbers for the N14 dual line set up and maybe an image so you can see what it looks like.

 

[eldgenb]

So with increased fuel demand do you feel that the lines leading from the tank all the way to the pump are large enough? Do we leave them alone or try to increase there size to?

When you split your lines would you not just split them as the came from the pump and one runs to the front head and one to the rear head?

There is a lot of discussion about replacing all of the #10 fuel line and filter all the way to the tank and upgrade it to #12 with a new filter head. I may do this someday but I have no desire to crawl around in the mud this time of year.

 

[oldMan99]

Subscribing... Thanks!

 

[jwaller]

a pic of the dual line setup would be nice, is there any reason to put it on a nhc250?

 

[Bighurt]

a pic of the dual line setup would be nice, is there any reason to put it on a nhc250?

The end result will be similar for both as they are both similar in the design.

Combining this with the turbo kit would be the first steps I would do towards getting more power.

I wonder if anyone has installed a Inter-cooler on these trucks.

 

[oldMan99]

The end result will be similar for both as they are both similar in the design.

Combining this with the turbo kit would be the first steps I would do towards getting more power.

I wonder if anyone has installed a Inter-cooler on these trucks.

Not to hi-jack this thread in any way, but... Seems to me that by the time you spend about $5,000 on a turbo set up for the 250 and then even more if you wanted to intercool it....

NOTE: I am working off the info that I was given that the turbo kit for the 250 is in the $5k price range (without intercooler).

I certainly understand the more reasonably priced "hop-up" options and tuning, but when you get close to $5k for a mod you have to start to wonder....

For about $5k you could put a 350hp turbocharged, intercooled 5.9 in the truck and still have the option to massage it to give something close to or in the 500hp range should you really want to...

It is significantly more work to do a complete engine change than to simply install a turbo, and it does alter the truck from being historically correct (but so does installing a turbo...lol) But in the end you'll have far more available power for about the same financial investment.

If the 250 was a multi-fuel I could see the post-apocalyptic scenario for availability of fuel as an argument but being the 250 is diesel only that does not apply...

I'm just sayin....

And now, back to your main topic....

 

[M920]

Not to hi-jack this thread in any way, but... Seems to me that by the time you spend about $5,000 on a turbo set up for the 250 and then even more if you wanted to intercool it....

NOTE: I am working off the info that I was given that the turbo kit for the 250 is in the $5k price range (without intercooler).

I certainly understand the more reasonably priced "hop-up" options and tuning, but when you get close to $5k for a mod you have to start to wonder....

For about $5k you could put a 350hp turbocharged, intercooled 5.9 in the truck and still have the option to massage it to give something close to or in the 500hp range should you really want to...

It is significantly more work to do a complete engine change than to simply install a turbo, and it does alter the truck from being historically correct (but so does installing a turbo...lol) But in the end you'll have far more available power for about the same financial investment.

If the 250 was a multi-fuel I could see the post-apocalyptic scenario for availability of fuel as an argument but being the 250 is diesel only that does not apply...

I'm just sayin....

And now, back to your main topic....

One of the problems you run in to with turbo charging a NTC 250, is the fact that this engine does not have any piston cooling oil squirters, that keep the pistons from melting in the later Big Cam engines, when working them hard. The turbo kit for the 250 was originally designed, more for altitude compensation and to reduce black smoke, then to make serious power.
It is my opinion that one is better off swaping in a Big Cam 350 or 400 if you want power and reliabillity. (I would not use the 5.9B in a 5 ton) If you don't run jake brakes it will fit right under the stock hood.

Soni

 

[nevrenufhp]

Mind if I use this thread as a reference link?

 

[jwaller]

the turbo kit I have only cost about 2k. it would be 5k if you bought all new parts.

The EGT's on the 250 when I run them turbo'd are lower than stock so in theory it should last longer not shorter.

 

[oldMan99]

One of the problems you run in to with turbo charging a NTC 250, is the fact that this engine does not have any piston cooling oil squirters, that keep the pistons from melting in the later Big Cam engines, when working them hard. The turbo kit for the 250 was originally designed, more for altitude compensation and to reduce black smoke, then to make serious power.

Soni, That is very good info to know! - Thanks!

It is my opinion that one is better off swaping in a Big Cam 350 or 400 if you want power and reliabillity. (I would not use the 5.9B in a 5 ton) If you don't run jake brakes it will fit right under the stock hood.

Soni

Will a 350/400 fit in a Deuce? Weight issue?

Other than displacement, what other significant differences are there between the 350 and 400?

Is there an automatic transmission (Preferably with OD) that will work with the 400?

Would there be any reason to go with the 350 instead of the 400?

 

[Floridianson]

Soni, That is very good info to know! - Thanks!
Will a 350/400 fit in a Deuce? Weight issue?

Might want to post that one in the hotrod Deuce forum?

 

[oldMan99]

Might want to post that one in the hotrod Deuce forum?

Thought about that but since "the issue" was brought up here and it was only a small part of the post I figured it was maybe OK here....

 

[eldgenb]

Will a 350/400 fit in a Deuce? Weight issue?

Other than displacement, what other significant differences are there between the 350 and 400?

Is there an automatic transmission (Preferably with OD) that will work with the 400?

Would there be any reason to go with the 350 instead of the 400?

No they will not fit in a deuce, the 350 and 400 are the same displacement just more supporting power mods ie boost fuel and some engine upgrades. There are plenty of Allison Auto's that will work with both but be prepared to pay big $$. You can go with whatever you find in the 855 cu inch family anywhere from the NHC 250 in the stock 5 tons all the way up the the electronically controlled N14. All shared the same overall block and would be a bolt in with hood modifications and adding an inter cooler on some of the later models.

 

[eldgenb]

Here is a pic I found of the overall look of the dual fuel mod.

 

[Bighurt]

Here is a pic I found of the overall look of the dual fuel mod.

That's funny I posted its brother earlier. I choose the one I used because it showed where the fuel plug was better. At least IMO.

Looking at eh pictures make you wonder why they didn't do that in the first place.

 

[eldgenb]

That's funny I posted its brother earlier. I choose the one I used because it showed where the fuel plug was better. At least IMO.

Looking at eh pictures make you wonder why they didn't do that in the first place.

Yeah makes me wonder with the plug in the block and all what their intention was for it in the first place if not too use it for fuel?

 

[M920]

the turbo kit I have only cost about 2k. it would be 5k if you bought all new parts.

The EGT's on the 250 when I run them turbo'd are lower than stock so in theory it should last longer not shorter.

You are absolutely correct, the turbo, if properly installed and with the right amount of fuel, will run lower EGTs and won't hurt the NTC 250 at all. It will actually give you better fuel milage and a bit more power ....I was talking, if you turn up the fuel on it, to try to get more then 50 extra hp, and start pulling hard, with heavy loads..... then IT WILL MELT THE PISTONS!!!..... Don't ask me how I know this..... lol

Soni

 

[promodhotrod]

Sorry I have not yet figured out how to post a picture. I just put a Y in the line above the shutoff solenoid and ran some stainless hard line left over from the racecar (available at Jegs or Summitt) with associated fittings to the pressure test port on the front of the front head. I think that hardline is rated around 600 psi so shouldnt be an issue sub 300. Also wanted to mention I could not tell any power difference, just ran smoother.
Have you ever considered propane fumagation for this engine, I have no experience with it, but seems if it works on an ISB then maybee it might work on the BC....???

 

[promodhotrod]

I have a question on the lower EGT 250 with turbo post, is this upstream or downstream of the turbo? I cant imagne it being lower upstream of the turbo.