3 push start

[cornrichard]

I have had my deuce for about 5 months. It has always started instantly when you push the button. After a recent road trip I noticed it getting harder to start. I checked the valve adjustment, a few were loose so I reset them. I checked the fuel shut down by pulling the cover on the side of the pump. It was free. The truck runs the same as always. I have not been putting as much waste oil in lately, but I did change the fuel filters just to be sure that was not the problem. To start it you have to turn the engine over for 2-3 seconds three times in a row. It starts right up on the third try. It does low idle for just a few seconds after the start and then runs like normal. Any ideas? I am out of them unless the injector pump need work.

 

[Carl_in_NH]

Does the in-tank fuel pump seem to be working? Can check it by turning the main switch on and opening the bleeder on the secondary filter to see that it's making pressure - without the engine running.

Could put a gage on it for a better test.

 

[cornrichard]

I used the in tank pump to prime the filter housings when I changed the filters, It worked fine. Thanks for the gauge idea, any guess on how much pressure there should be?

 

[Parker2]

I doubt it's the in tank pump. Many people on the forum are running without the pump working. Me for one and my truck starts right up.
I would guess that your having a little drane back. Just a guess but maybe check your injector lines.
I think your getting air in the lines somewhere.

 

[TedG]

I had a deuce that had very similar symptoms and then the IP puked out. I hope that is not what you are facing!

 

[badgmc56]

The in-tank pump is there for a reason! It is a lift and push pump. It's job is to keep the fuel line energized. The injector pumps were not designed to pull fuel although they will. My deuce had the same symtoms as yours and I found the in-tank pump not working. It was running but not pumping. Just because some guys run without them , it does not mean it is the correct thing to do.

 

[Divemaster920]

I had that happen to me. Two days later, I noticed that the manifold flame heater was leaking. I fixed that, and that fixed that. I think air was getting into the IP.

 

[Parker2]

The in-tank pump is there for a reason! It is a lift and push pump. It's job is to keep the fuel line energized. The injector pumps were not designed to pull fuel although they will. My deuce had the same symtoms as yours and I found the in-tank pump not working. It was running but not pumping. Just because some guys run without them , it does not mean it is the correct thing to do.

Maybe it's not the correct thing to do, but having so many trucks running without a good lift pump would give a good indication that it's not a big deal.
Again, I would suggest looking for ways that air may be getting into the lines.

 

[jblack6527]

A question for the OP, will it start up easier if you hold the fuel pedal to the floor when cranking? Just curious, because that's the way mine does.

 

[Coal Cracker]

The in-tank pump is there for a reason! It is a lift and push pump. It's job is to keep the fuel line energized. The injector pumps were not designed to pull fuel although they will. My deuce had the same symtoms as yours and I found the in-tank pump not working. It was running but not pumping. Just because some guys run without them , it does not mean it is the correct thing to do.

 

[ctmustang]

I've heard lots of bad things from friends who ran any waste oil in their deuces. No problems at first and then all heck breaks loose. I would agree with checking the intake pump. the TM says if I remember rite 3-5 lbs. of pressure at the fitting on top of tank. Also would agree with the possibility of air or drainback. Check all your connections for tightness and signs of leakage.

 

[kipman]

My brother and I run wmo with no issues, going on two years and no problem other than harder to start when very cold, then use the either start.

 

[1stDeuce]

So a lot of you don't throttle your deuces when you crank them? And they start anyway? I don't know how mine would start with no throttle, but it rips right off with a light pedal. I come off the feed right after it starts, let it run 6-700RPM until the oi pressure comes up. If I don't keep feeding it some in the first 15 seconds or so, it'll barely run. I think it'd take a good bit of cranking if I didn't feed it a little... And I'm pretty sure it had a brandy new engine when I picked it up about 800 miles ago...
Just my $.02
Chris

 

[TIGERFANS2]

So a lot of you don't throttle your deuces when you crank them? And they start anyway?

Charged my batteries today (ok, an excuse to hear it run), stood next to the truck with the door open, the hand throttle pushed all the way in. Touched the button and away it went, right NOW, like every time I've started it since I bought it.

I 'spect they're all a bit different

 

[Parker2]

Dont want to hijack this thread, but thought this may interest some of you that think the electric pump is very important. I am not saying it's not nice to have, but I dont think it's all that important - more of a convenience.
I had to move my duece tonight without a fuel tank. Rigged it up with a one gallon can and another to catch the return.
As you can see plenty of fuel is coming back in the return and this is at idle. This is going thru 3 spin on filters and one of them is 2 micron. Imagine how much fuel is moving at higher rpms.

 

[Chief_919]

Dont want to hijack this thread, but thought this may interest some of you that think the electric pump is very important. I am not saying it's not nice to have, but I dont think it's all that important - more of a convenience.
I had to move my duece tonight without a fuel tank. Rigged it up with a one gallon can and another to catch the return.
As you can see plenty of fuel is coming back in the return and this is at idle. This is going thru 3 spin on filters and one of them is 2 micron. Imagine how much fuel is moving at higher rpms.

It will run, sure. It will move fuel, sure.

Is it a good idea? No.

While the IP can move that much fuel, it is very hard on it. Result= early IP failure.

Imagine a loaded train with two locomotives. Now turn one locomotive off- would you claim that because the train can still move all is well? You are overstressing the one running locomotive, so of course it is not. It will still run, but that one locomotive will soon wear out from the excessive load.

The IP is not designed to move the fuel. Because it will, for a while, does not mean it is good for it.

 

[Parker2]

^^^The lift pump is two gears or sprockets on the lower part of the ip and they are moving the same rpm's wether the electric pump is on or not.

 

[Keith_J]

The purpose of the lift pump is to assure flow even if the fuel is partially gelled. Since diesel is a broad mix of hydrocarbons, when fuel gels, only parts of it gel, there is still a liquid portion. The lift pump will homogenize the gelled fuel and make flow possible as well as generate pressure and a bit of heat.

Now, with respect to waste motor oil..it is very hard on the injector pump, raising pressure and subsequently, load on the cam plate/rollers. And the suspended junk in used motor oils can cause wear on the check valves, injectors and their nozzles.

 

[cornrichard]

My lift pump works, It was one of the first things I checked. I am at a bit of a loss as to how lift pumps became such a big part of this thread. I appreciate the advice on checking for drain back. I did not see anything leaking when I adjusted the valves but I will check this over really close today. The main reason I am mixing in some waste oil is to lube the injector pump. The new low sulphur fuel is very dry. I may switch to a diesel additive for added lube. The truck does start better if I give it some pedal.

 

[Chief_919]

^^^The lift pump is two gears or sprockets on the lower part of the ip and they are moving the same rpm's wether the electric pump is on or not.

Indeed it does- but the stress on the gears, and the shafts, etc is not the same when it is doing all the work as it is when the lift pump is puhsing fuel to it.

Speed does not cause extra wear, and it does remain the same. The amount of load placed on the gears will affect the wear.