Driving with a blown cyl head gasket?

[antennaclimber]

Not as catastrophic as yours, but a similar demise.
Seems to be a common point of failure for head gaskets on this type of engine.


Karl

 

[dabtl]

Here's the damage. Still scratching my head on this one. The gasket appears to be good around the coolant ports but I had about a quart of coolant in the intake when I pulled it. It appeared to be isolated to #5 & 6cyls. No antifreeze in the cyls so I assume it migrated its way past the rings and into the pan from sitting. The good news is I rolled it over by hand and the cyls look good, don't see any cracks or pits so hopefully it will have a heartbeat again soon.

The machine shop hasn't found any cracks or damage other than .002-.003 out of flat on the rear head. Anyone see one blow like this or ideas?

Thanks, Mike.

I had a gasket that looked like that one. Check the head for cracks. Mine was in the intake port above the valve.

 

[mbehne]

Hopefully for what the machine shop swindled me out of they are good. They said they mangafluxed them and found nothing and went over them with a fine tooth comb and all they found was valves need ground and slight warp right at the back of the rear head. I guess I'll keep my fingers crossed they are good and that the previous owner didn't hydrolic it and bend the rod. I think he's being honest as the antifreeze I found in the oil was isolated to the rear sump only. If he had ran it, I would think it should have had some in both sumps. Also when I rolled it over to look at the sleeves the pistons appeared to come up to the correct height...


mike

 

[dabtl]

Hopefully for what the machine shop swindled me out of they are good. They said they mangafluxed them and found nothing and went over them with a fine tooth comb and all they found was valves need ground and slight warp right at the back of the rear head. I guess I'll keep my fingers crossed they are good and that the previous owner didn't hydrolic it and bend the rod. I think he's being honest as the antifreeze I found in the oil was isolated to the rear sump only. If he had ran it, I would think it should have had some in both sumps. Also when I rolled it over to look at the sleeves the pistons appeared to come up to the correct height...


mike

New heads are available for $400, ask me how I know.

 

[mbehne]

She's ALIVE...and mad as HE double hockey sticks...and all I can say is WOW. I've never first hand experienced a run-a-way diesel until now.

First things first, I think I need to thank God, my ol'man and this forum!!! Thru reading the boards I figured it might not be a bad idea to leave the air filter off on first startup, just in case. Little did I know it probably saved the engine.

No time now, got to go to parent teacher conferences but will post up the story later...

mike

 

[mbehne]

Well, on with the learning experience, which is really the main reason I bought this truck.

So, as the previous posts state, I have just finished replacing the head gaskets and going through the heads. As far as I can tell every part of this has been done following the tm to a T. Beings I have never heard this truck run, I figured a few extra minutes were in order, so I went ahead and gave the linkage, fuel shutoff, batteries, hoses and such a once over. Everything seams to be in order.

The moment of truth... Master on, check. Fuel shut off out, check. Transmission in neutral, check. Everyone clear, check. Just wanting to crank her over for a little to help build oil pressure before starting her for the first time in over a year, I hit the start button for just a second. Great, she rolls over on her own, no funny noises, no hydro-lock. I proceed to hit the starter again thinking to myself, give her ten seconds and then push the fuel shut off in. Well, she made one full second of cranking and fired...fuel shut off still out, double and triple check...fuel system was just completely apart...should still have air in the injectors... By my two second count the slight miss went away and the tach starts going north of 2300...!?,..!!.??-/@&... Lucky for me I did have the air filter removed, a 2x6 and tools laying on the fender just incase. As instructed beforehand, dad hits the air intake with the 2x which slows her down to a hair under 1500 but will not kill her. I figure he's buying me time so I run for the tools, clamp the fuel feed off to the secondary filters and grab a heavy shop rug we use and tell him the plan...quick switch...she gains RPM quickly but the rug hit well before the grenade point...still only slowing her down but no kill. This time the black smoke starts rolling and we get her slowed to about 1000RPM. At this point I wasn't sure what else to do but wait. Which, by the way isn't possible in the situation, so over the drivers fender I go, flip open the secondary bleeder hopeing to induce some air into the fuel system. All the while grabbing the fuel shutoff shaft with the other hand yanking for all it's worth...she dies. Whewwwww, thank God. If I didn't have an extra set of hands standing right there I'm not sure what would have happened. I know it would have been easy to just hit 5th and dump the clutch to kill it, but thru all of the checks, the one that checks for trucks parked behind and the 80x120 building she's nosed up to was bypassed or overlooked. I'm still not for sure what caused it or for that matter what got her whoaed. I didn't feel the fuel shut off give when I yanked but who knows or did she just finally burn thru the fuel she had....

Sorry for the rambling, probably unreadable post...blood pressure and heart rate not quite back to normal just yet.

 

[bchauvette]

I have seen the result of gasoline engines running with a leak from the combustion chamber. The block was in for weld repair where the leak path trenched the block. If there is no coolant leak I think pulling the injector is the way to go. I imagine you need to capture the fuel some how.

 

[iatractor]

Mike, you are really re-enforcing my decision to not buy this truck!! This appears to be about the first time I have read about these diesels running away with themselves. Fairly common on the old screaming detroits back in the day. Considering this engine was re-incarnated/bastardized into some various Oliver tractors and silage choppers the stories might be more common than we know about. Glad the thing didn't ventilate the block, otherwise we might be reading about how you had to dig shrapnel out of yourself. Looks like I might be calling you for some parts if I need some.

 

[mbehne]

After stewing on it all night and reading up on the boards I'm going to look at the IP tonight. Several have posted about the fuel control rod behind the shutoff getting gummed up/seized.


http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showthread.php?78640-stuck-in-full-throttle-multi

 

[o1951]

Make sure it was fuel burning, not engine oil.
Suggest moving it so you can put it in 5th and ease clutch if somehow it happens again.

 

[hndrsonj]

While you are at it; plug the fording attachment point on the back of the air cleaner. That's why it wouldn't shut off with the 2x4.

 

[mbehne]

While you are at it; plug the fording attachment point on the back of the air cleaner. That's why it wouldn't shut off with the 2x4.

I assume that is on the lower filter hsg...no air cleaner assy on at the time. The 2x was directly against the upper adapter where the filter would seat. I rechecked all the connections and they are good and tight so I'm not sure where it got its air, but it did.

The problem did turn out to be a stuck fuel control rod...stuck bad enough the fuel shutoff didn't move it to kill the fuel. When I reached down and physically grabbed the cable and yanked it must have gave just enough to do the deed...kind of hard to believe as hard as I yanked repeatedly on the shutoff on the dash it didn't get it done.

Well anyway, the saga continues...fixed the fuel rod and she fires right up without touching the throttle unlike my other truck. Let her run for about a half hour to warm up and somewhat limber up. Life is great, she sounds great, ok to good oil pressure, great air pressure and pedal feel, no leaks or seeps anywhere and she spools right up... Shut her down and that even goes as planned. Restart her 2-3 times after a few minutes going over everything. Uneventful at best...until the 4th restart/run cycle...she light right up but the starter decides it's job isn't done yet and keeps cranking away. No biggy, hit he master, starter is still engaged...shoot. Yell at soldier b to unhook the battery, hit the fuel shutoff and all goes as planned, starter stops startin and engine stops as asked. So I guess I'll break out the ohm meter and make sure it's just at solenoid stuck.

I'm starting to think my soldiers ol'workhorse was liking retired life and is protesting! Anybody know a good "duece whisperer" that might be able to convince her that she going to get the easy life now...if not a good exorcist might be in order. Lol

 

[mbehne]

Well, after freeing up the sticking fuel control rod and cleaning up the solenoid, she start and runs. I've let her warm up several times now with no signs of any leaks, internal or external. The motor actually sounds amazingly good and starts so much better than my good truck. I'm not sure if it's the extra compression from the valve job or he pump is set differently but one push of the button and she fires. No accelerator pedal, no nothing. Granted it hasn't been that cold but was in the lower 40's this morning when I started it to warm it up.

I also drained and flushed the cooling system for the last time and filled her with antifreeze mix...didn't figure I would waste money on coolant until I had some time on the engine and thought she would make it.

Last, but not least, replaced the broken parking brake cable and adjusted the shoes to spec. I'm not really sure how they ever worked, as they were so far out of the book spec and the bracket that holds the cable under the lever was installed backwards, which is why the cable was broken in the first place.

I don't want to jinx myself, but hopefully I can get a few more things/checks done without too many gremlins showing up and give the brakes a good going over so she is ready for her maiden voyage soon.

 

[mbehne]

Just thought I would put the mechanical oil pressure gauge on her last night to check the accuracy of the in-dash gauge as it was only running 30psi cold and 20 warm...WOW...is it that hard to get the correct oil pressure sender? I'm two for two, that is two deuces, two incorrect senders. My first one had a 120psi gauge running a 60psi sender now the blue bomb has a 60psi gauge and a 120psi sender. On the bright side, the oil pressure is great and I don't have to buy one for it, as the one I took off the other truck was perfect!!!

Mike