Engine shut off/locked up. Will not crank.

[ODdave]

JJensen, are you the guy that was gonna buy a deuce from dennis up here?

Pooch, I got a hunch its not gonna be a converter problem........

 

[gimpyrobb]

Wow. some crazy responces.

I wouldn't think a belt driven accessory could stop a multifuel motor. First thing I'd do is put the T-case in neutral and the trans in 4th(1:1). See if you can move the short shaft. Then try with trans in neutral. Look up in the inspection hole to see if you can find anything wrong in there. I don't know why you guys would recommend dumping the oil first, thats $50+ right off the bat. Look around and see what you can find with out doing anything expensive.

 

[Westech]

that engine sounds like its toast.... Did you check the oil ? is there any in it? the gauge can read 1000000000000 PSI and if there is not enough oil its just as bad as being out. A big noise like that and a locked up engine.... sorry dude dont sound good.
Do what Gimp says but ... I would start looking for another engine.

 

[JJensen]

Thanks again for all the responses.

G-Force, I'm going to drain the oil, and check out the engine after I rule out accessories, and trans/clutch failure. Warranty wise....well we all know that there is no warranty with something used, especially like this. But, the guy that I was in contact with on the purchase was selling it for his friend. They all had them, and his friend didn't want to mess with selling it. Anyway, I knew up front that he made $1,000 profit from selling it. He gave me that back. I had to drive all the way back that night and get it, but I have it. He didn't have to give me anything. He was a good guy.

ODdave, yes I was going to buy a truck from Dennis. He is a great guy. He is still emailing and calling to help me fix this one that I didn't buy from him. I don't think that it is going to be a converter problem either.

gimpyrobb, I agree with you. I'm going to check the "free" stuff first. Others had mentioned putting the t-case in neutral, and turning the short shaft while trans is in gear. I will do that. I also don't think that an accessory could lock up the engine while trying to drive, but possibly at idle. I had taken it out of gear and was idling the engine when it rattled really loud and locked up.

Westech, yes I checked the oil on the pre-trip. I have also looked at the oil level since the this happened. It is full, and very clear. Looks like oil straight out of the jug. It is supposed to only have 2 hours on it, all from me driving.

OK, well once again I really appreciate everyone's help and responses. At this point I just need to do some work on it and I'll report back with what I find. I'm sure most of you guys will be interested in knowing what caused this.

I'm leaning towards:
fluid out the bell is from trans being over filled, or a plugged vent
all of the smoke from under the truck was from the belts
locked up generator or air compressor
(leaning this way because of my fiance saying it smelled like burnt rubber)

or
clutch smoke and a junk transmission or clutch assembly

It may turn out to be the engine, but that wouldn't explain why there was so much smoke coming from under the truck. It had completely fogged out my fiance that was right behind me. I could only see the smoke and her headlights. If it were a rod bearing, I would think that it would have given done more than made a bunch of noise for 15 seconds and then locked up. I haven't even looked, but if the belts were smoking that bad, I'm sure I would be able to see glazing or chunks on them now.

I am also going to look to see if anyone has adjusted the pump. I will be installing an EGT gauge and a boost gauge anyway, just for reference.

Thanks again! I'll let everyone know. It will be a day or 2 before I'll have time to get back out to where the truck is.

 

[big1096]

Good luck on what you find. I hope it's a relatively "simple" fix.

 

[rrrr]

Take a look at the IP and see if it looks like its been adjusted. Mine has a small cover over the nuts and is safety wired. You could have a lot of little things that caused the big problem. I'm concerned about the condition of your oil looking like new after two hours of running ? But you said you had good oil pressure ? Maybe your oil pressure wasn't that good if you have a mismatched sender and gauge ? I like the idea of trying to turn the motor with a breaker bar with everything in neutral it will tell you alot.

I live in Troy, Mo so not too far away from you. If I can help out let me know. My Deuce is down for a 395 wheel upgrade. Waiting on new studs and nuts for the rear axles but should be up and running for the weekend.

 

[Heavysteven]

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[Ferroequinologist]

I've heard of transmissions somehow getting into two gears at once- I don't know if this can happen with a deuce transmission or not. I would check everything around the engine first- then the only other thing it could be was the engine.

Belts squealing could be anything- the clanging could have been a failed air compressor. But I would think the multi would just eat the belt and keep running- I had an alt fail and lock up, and the engine just burned the belts off and kept running, and that was at idle.

It could be possible you had two things fail at the same time- lightning DOES strike twice ( come watch a pine tree near me during the summer, I've counted 5 hits to the top so far in a year)

Good luck and see if you can't get someones number so you can be on the phone with them at your truck- better than driving back home and getting on here only so we can say, well try this. Then you have to wait to get back out there. Heck, I'll PM you my number, or Gimp would be better than me at it. (not meaning to volunteer him.)

 

[JJensen]

I'm home at lunch and the fiance were talking about the situation. Just didn't mention to me that there were sparks coming from under the truck while all the smoke was happening. She said that that right before I pulled over it looked like fireworks under the truck.

So....that tells me that it isn't an internal engine/trans/transfer case issue. It has to be an accessory or the clutch. The clutch pedal felt fine pushing it in and out, and when I shifted the last 2 gears it controlled the engine RPM.

I am almost certain that it has to be the generator or the air compressor. During the drive home, the generator/volt gauge was bouncing around some. I didn't know if that was normal in the way that they regulate, or if it was a gauge issue.

My friend that has the truck at his place it going to look at the belts and accessories tonight. Then he will check the trans the way that gimpyrobb said to.

rrrr, you are about 3 hours away. I appreciate the offer. I broke down very close to you. I pulled the truck off I-70 at exit 212, and took it down to a business entrance called Etrailers.com

Maybe I have multiple issues. We'll see....

Before the truck gets driven again, I am going to change/rebuild the turbo (I would prefer a whistler I think???). But, it has too much play, and I can see where the impeller has touched off. I'll take pics this week.

I am also going to look at and take a pic of the pump. If it has been turned up, I want to return it to stock until I have gauges.

I do have one question since you guys are being so easy on me even though I am a newbie on here:

Is it normal for the engine oil to still appear clean? When I change the oil in my Cummins engines it is black right after starting the truck back up.

 

[dittle]

The only way I can think of oil staying clean is if the block was flushed to remove all of the contamination that is hiding in it after oil is drained. I don't know how quickly a MF would dirty up oil, but can't imagine a change would let it be clean.

 

[oddshot]

1) I drove right at 2200-2300 RPM, oil pressure pegged at 60, coolant at 180-190.

2) This truck had great power. It would hardly even slow down on hills, even though I didn't really increase the throttle much.

3) The oil is full, and very clean. It looks brand new, which seems odd to me. I know that it was new oil, but all diesels that I have ever had will blacken the oil almost instantly.

I gotta tell you ... those three things make your truck WAY different from my Deuce.

60 PSI of oil pressure?

Mine is a tick under 30 PSI hot or cold ... 1,000 to 2,300 RPM. It was that way for 600 + miles from Maryland ... and its been that every time I've taken her outta the yard since.

"Pinned at 60 PSI" just seems a bit high to me.


and ... oh yeah!!! BTW...

Give your girl friend high marks for being observant.

Some GUYS wouldn't have noticed the "burned rubber smell" ... SOME probably wouldn't have noticed the fireworks display!!!

Both of those observations could be very important.

oddshot

 

[JDToumanian]

Is it normal for the engine oil to still appear clean?

Mine would stay clean, a nice amber color like it was just poured from the jug, for a few hours worth of driving then it slowly would start to darken with soot. Now I have a centrifugal bypass oil filter so it stays clean for over 1000 miles.

you guys are being so easy on me even though I am a newbie on here

Well, so far you haven't committed any forum foe paws!

SAFETY TIP! If you bar over the engine, be sure the fuel shut off (stop cable) is pulled all the way out. Multifuel engines can start very easily.

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Ya know at the top of the page under "thread tools" you can select "subscribe to thread"...

Jon

 

[Ferroequinologist]

I just changed the oil in my 04 dodge diesel, and it is already black from just driving around the locomotive barn here at work. 3 gal of oil.

Last time I changed my deuce's oil, it was black in about 5min of idle.

Let us know what you find out.

 

[Capt.Marion]

Just a generally good starting place that isn't expensive but is VERY SMART for EVERY vehicle that is new to you:

Drain the oil and drop the pan and look for loose hardware/metal etc...


It's always a good idea to get acquainted with your engine.


I'd start there, and start checking other places.

 

[jwright]

Where abouts do you live in Kansas city? And how far is the truck from you ?

 

[jwright]

If its not real far I have a tow bar, we can get to your house. Just need a little fuel money. I am not working right now so I have the time.

 

[rrrr]

I'm leaning toward the air compressor and or generator to check first since it is very easy. If the air compressor let loose I believe it uses engine oil for lube. You might want to pull the pan to make sure no metal from the air compressor made it down there.

Exit 212 is not far away. I was even at home working on my Deuce ! Hang in there you'll get it working again.

 

[ranchhopper]

Smell the oil make sure its not diluted with fuel if it is excess fuel washes all the oil out of the bearings and washes the cylinders clean as stated before it could be spun bearings.

 

[m-35tom]

ok, so i will speculate as well. don't bother with putting anything in neutral, neutral may not exsist anymore. hold the clutch in and see if it will turn. also taking the belts off is a good idea, but if they stopped the engine, they should show some grief.

form what you describe, my money is on 2nd gear welding itself to the mainshaft, which means you are now in 2nd ALL the time regardless of what other gear you choose. or the input shaft bearing failed and locked up which would account for the oil from the clutch housing and any 'sparks' that may have been seen.

in either case just hold the clutch in and see.

tom

 

[rickf]

The part about the pegged oil pressure and the clean oil keeps haunting me. I am thinking a main oil passage or filter was clogged and not circulating any oil through the motor. Sparks out the bottom could be a failed engine but it would be REAL obvious! That sounds like clutch. I am betting that you hold the clutch in when starting so if it hand grenaded it would not feel normal. If it does feel normal then holding it in would take a failed transmission out of the loop. There is no way accessory belts are going to lock an engine, they will burn right off. IF you had no oil circulating then there would be none to the turbo also. Or the air pump, if it has an oil supply, I am not that familiar with these.Just some things to think about.

Rick