M1088 camper conversion

[PacificNorthWestLMTV]

Walls/roof framing going up:

Slow work, but feeling good to make progress again.

Looking good, keep it up! Thank you for documenting your steps too, very helpful...

 

[ckouba]

Starting to look more like a jungle-gym than a camper for now. Regarding the diagonal bracing, I want the frame itself to have a bit of rigidity without shear panels on it so I went diagonally. It may be non-traditional (I haven't seen anyone else doing it this way) but I wanted the structural integrity from the triangulation. Doesn't look like a lot of work but it's definitely challenging to put this all together solo, and I worked through the weekend until I ran out of metal. Will need to make another run this week.

Also mocked in the doorway:

and stairs to validate the concept and layout:

 

[Mullaney]

Starting to look more like a jungle-gym than a camper for now. Regarding the diagonal bracing, I want the frame itself to have a bit of rigidity without shear panels on it so I went diagonally. It may be non-traditional (I haven't seen anyone else doing it this way) but I wanted the structural integrity from the triangulation. Doesn't look like a lot of work but it's definitely challenging to put this all together solo, and I worked through the weekend until I ran out of metal. Will need to make another run this week.

Also mocked in the doorway:

and stairs to validate the concept and layout:

Really Nice ckouba ,

Steps are really nice start. Hard to tell from this angle, but I am guessing the bottom of the tank lines up with the bottom step? And up on the deck (much later) there will be some sort of wall to keep you from tumbling down those steps in the dark

Definitely a nice sturdy lighter weight than wood design!

.

 

[ckouba]

Really Nice ckouba ,

Thanks. It's sometimes difficult to work alone, everything seems like a great idea with no one to disagree with you. Any and all feedback is welcome.

Steps are really nice start. Hard to tell from this angle, but I am guessing the bottom of the tank lines up with the bottom step?

Affirmative. The steps are a little further out laterally than the tank, but the bottom of that 2x2 piece across the bottom is just above the bottom plane of the tank brackets.

And up on the deck (much later) there will be some sort of wall to keep you from tumbling down those steps in the dark

I have an even more ingenious plan. To the right of the stairs (descending) will be the galley cabinets. Configured at the end of those cabinets will be some sort of drawbridge style plank that when we're inside and buttoned up, it can be pivoted down to cover the opening and functional as a floor. To the left will be the bench/dinette seating, which will have some sort of armrest containment to keep from sliding into the abyss.

 

[B-Dog]

Nice work! Thanks for the update! I do 99% of my work solo, I feel the struggle.

I have an even more ingenious plan. To the right of the stairs (descending) will be the galley cabinets. Configured at the end of those cabinets will be some sort of drawbridge style plank that when we're inside and buttoned up, it can be pivoted down to cover the opening and functional as a floor. To the left will be the bench/dinette seating, which will have some sort of armrest containment to keep from sliding into the abyss.

I totally dig the stair concept. I'm much more fearful of someone stumbling down the stairs that you typically see on these types of campers when the door is 5+ feet above the ground and no railing.

 

[ramdough]

Thanks. It's sometimes difficult to work alone, everything seems like a great idea with no one to disagree with you. Any and all feedback is welcome.



Affirmative. The steps are a little further out laterally than the tank, but the bottom of that 2x2 piece across the bottom is just above the bottom plane of the tank brackets.



I have an even more ingenious plan. To the right of the stairs (descending) will be the galley cabinets. Configured at the end of those cabinets will be some sort of drawbridge style plank that when we're inside and buttoned up, it can be pivoted down to cover the opening and functional as a floor. To the left will be the bench/dinette seating, which will have some sort of armrest containment to keep from sliding into the abyss.

Enjoying the build.

Just a thought.... instead of using all-thread in your design, why not use something like this:

3/4 X 14 Threaded Rod, 16 TPI with Oil Finish - Dsuban Spring

3/4 X 14 Threaded Rod, 16 TPI with Oil Finish. These rods have ''cold rolled threads'' and have multiple applications and uses.

www.dsuban.com

You will not have any threads rubbing as the subframe separates from the truck frame.

Just a thought.

Building solo is so much less efficient than having one extra person. I feel your pain.

Can’t wait for your next updates.


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[Mullaney]

Thanks. It's sometimes difficult to work alone, everything seems like a great idea with no one to disagree with you. Any and all feedback is welcome.



Affirmative. The steps are a little further out laterally than the tank, but the bottom of that 2x2 piece across the bottom is just above the bottom plane of the tank brackets.



I have an even more ingenious plan. To the right of the stairs (descending) will be the galley cabinets. Configured at the end of those cabinets will be some sort of drawbridge style plank that when we're inside and buttoned up, it can be pivoted down to cover the opening and functional as a floor. To the left will be the bench/dinette seating, which will have some sort of armrest containment to keep from sliding into the abyss.

.
Definitely like the idea even better for the door and stairs! Heck of a plan!

Sadly, I too work solo about 99% of the time. I guess that is why I have a forklift at work. It is the extra hands I need most of the time... And then there is the boom truck to raise things higher and further away - because my fork truck isn't rough terrain. I have finally figured out that a few hours outside, then relax under the shade tree, then repeat. (Rinse, Lather, Repeat)

.

 

[ckouba]

So.... I've been building in an RV-sized but still "single" carport without being able to really see this project in its entirety. I finally drove it out into the open yesterday and saw it for the first time in the wilds.

Uh, it's big!!

I did make it a little bigger than the drawing I had put together, adding the extra space for a larger sleeping area in the back. It's structurally fine, but I didn't think it'd have that large of an effect visually. looking at it on the road puts it in a new perspective. It's intimidating (at least for now) but we are excited to have all that space. It will just take a little getting used to it.

After walking around in the space, we talked through a new layout for the main cabin area:

Complicating layout is the desire to store our touring kayaks internally instead of on the roof. We're at 12' tall and I don't want to get any higher. The boats will go in the long box at the top of the drawing, under the counter area. This displaces some of the traditional storage locations, so our pantry and other items like that will be located in the lower right area. Final positioning of the countertop items will be determined once we have them in hand, but the concept is sink to the right on the counter, some space to its left, then the stovetop, microwave in the overhead, and possibly a countertop oven. Fridge will be in the pantry space to the lower right.

The closet in the lower left will be shared with mechanicals, clothes, and gear.

Looking at this, it's fairly similar to the layout we had in the Bigfoot, and we both think that in practice, it will feel a bit more open than the layout we were thinking about most recently.

It might be a while before I come to grips with the actual size, but we are very excited to take advantage of the space it will supply us.

 

[M1078MAN]

Wow, but typical tail affect, love your work

What about going forward, a more narrow space

 

[ckouba]

What about going forward, a more narrow space

I may not be fully awake yet, but I don't follow the question. What's the suggestion?

 

[coachgeo]

suggest you take it like it is thru some trails etc. to see how much the rear swing is good/not good for you.

 

[Mullaney]

suggest you take it like it is thru some trails etc. to see how much the rear swing is good/not good for you.

Hi ckouba,

I am going to repeat (echo) the comment from coachgeo:

You really need to give some real consideration to that part of your bix beyond the rear tires "swing" when you turn left or right. In tight quarters, you could easily take out another vehicle, a tree, or a building with the back of your truck.

We have a civilian 24 foot box here mounted on a F600 frame. Center of the box is just forward of the axle. VERY easy to wipe out another vehicle in a tight turn with the back of the box! Same problem in this case as what you are building now...

If you monitor your mirrors closely, you should be fine but again it could be bad if you turn it like your truck turns today.
Tight turns make the situation worse.

TIm

 

[M1078MAN]

I may not be fully awake yet, but I don't follow the question. What's the suggestion?

up over the cab, you could tie in a portal from the sleeping space to the cockpit, that way you reduce your overhang and still maintain close to the same space

 

[ckouba]

up over the cab

Not sure how much opportunity there is over the cab due to the tilting cab access to the motor. If you've got a creative solution, I'm all ears.

If you monitor your mirrors closely, you should be fine but again it could be bad if you turn it like your truck turns today.
Tight turns make the situation worse.

Regarding the swing of the overhang, I noticed this already just backing it in and out of my work space. I will poke around a bit more with it as-is and get more of a feel for it but I was pretty comfortable with it.

 

[M1078MAN]

Not sure how much opportunity there is over the cab due to the tilting cab access to the motor. If you've got a creative solution, I'm all ears.



Regarding the swing of the overhang, I noticed this already just backing it in and out of my work space. I will poke around a bit more with it as-is and get more of a feel for it but I was pretty comfortable with it.

Your right, what was I thinking.. didn't even consider the swing of the cab

 

[Mullaney]

Not sure how much opportunity there is over the cab due to the tilting cab access to the motor. If you've got a creative solution, I'm all ears.



Regarding the swing of the overhang, I noticed this already just backing it in and out of my work space. I will poke around a bit more with it as-is and get more of a feel for it but I was pretty comfortable with it.

.
Swing of the overhang is no problem at all for me.

Being alert to it will make you do the right thing.

Where it was bad for me was when the truck was loaned to a perfectly reasonable person
that took a turn a little too tightly and the steel bumper on the Civy truck knocked the
plastic bumper off the brand new Suburban parked beside it...

That was an expensive mistake.

That mistake with a "hit and run" because my "loanee" never even knew it happened could have been more miserable than it was.
Happily (for me) he happened to be standing here in my building when John Law showed up here.

 

[ramdough]

Some countries limit the overhand as a fraction of the wheelbase (front wheel to center of double bogie). I remember it is 2/3 or 1/3 for Australia. I could not find anything for the US.

You may look more than I did just to be sure. It would suck to get much further and find out there is a legal limit.

Where do your spare tires go? Any dirt bike racks?


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[ckouba]

Some countries limit the overhand as a fraction of the wheelbase (front wheel to center of double bogie). I remember it is 2/3 or 1/3 for Australia. I could not find anything for the US.

This was something I hadn't thought about until your post Doug. After a little searching, I am confident I am in the clear. Oregon is generous in their allowance. Per what I found online, we are allowed 3/4 of the wheelbase, and the wheelbase is from the front to rear axle. In that case, it's about 188 inches on a 1088, 75% of which is ~140. My overhang is about 122, giving me a bit of buffer as well.

Where do your spare tires go? Any dirt bike racks?

Spares will be longitudinally mounted in the cargo area in a manner similar to the way the OE set up was arranged. Details are still firming up in my head but I think it should all be workable.

 

[ramdough]

This was something I hadn't thought about until your post Doug. After a little searching, I am confident I am in the clear. Oregon is generous in their allowance. Per what I found online, we are allowed 3/4 of the wheelbase, and the wheelbase is from the front to rear axle. In that case, it's about 188 inches on a 1088, 75% of which is ~140. My overhang is about 122, giving me a bit of buffer as well.




Spares will be longitudinally mounted in the cargo area in a manner similar to the way the OE set up was arranged. Details are still firming up in my head but I think it should all be workable.

You may want to confirm how they calculate wheelbase. My understanding is that they measure from the front axle centerline to the bogie pin between your rear tires. On the data sheets for the 1088, it is 4100mm or 161in. 75% is 120”, but that is measured to the bogie pin between the rear tires, so you lose an additional 5 feet or so from the aft tire and space on either side. That puts your rear over hang closer to 5’ behind the stock truck frame (you need to do your own math here to get a real number.... just putting it in the ballpark).

I may be wrong, but that is my understanding.

Hope this is helpful. Please let me know what you learn.... I am learning too.


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[ckouba]

No worries at all Doug. Better to have a thorough discussion with you here than with Johnny Law on the side of the road or watch my rig get towed away.

The regs in OR are online. This is the link to the overhang section:

OAR 734-082-0030 – Overhang

(1) Permits are required for excessive front and/or rear overhang as follows, (a) Front overhang, When any load, including crane booms, log…

oregon.public.law

The relevant verbiage, both for the permissible dimensions and the definition of wheelbase:

"Rear overhang — Solo vehicle: Single trip or continuous trip If the rear overhang exceeds 3⁄4 of the wheelbase of the vehicle...."

" Wheelbase measurement will be from the center of the first axle to the center of the last axle of the vehicle or combination of vehicles."

First axle to last axle is ~188, 75% of which is 141. From the center of the rear axle to the rear of the camper is ~122", so I think I am good. If you poke through the regs (as exciting as that may sound!) and see something differently, please speak up. As big of a hassle as it would be to change now, it's only going to get more difficult as the build continues.

Edit - The above was the description for loads which require permits, with the presumption that if it didn't require a permit, then it was legal. Found the actual OR Vehicle code which states the legal vehicle size limits and it corroborates the info above with Table II of section 818.080 Maximum size limits. Link to the full code.