MEP-002 Cranks but won't Start

[DeucesWild11]

Hello, so I finally got around to playing with my new to me MEP-002. I got two fresh new batteries, pulled the fuel tank to get re-lined. Then I cleaned the fuel strainer and replaced the two fuel filters. I also put in new rotella 15-40 with a new oil filter. I used a bucket of clean diesel fuel and placed the fuel lines in it. It's pulling new fuel out and returning the unused fuel back. After warming it with the glow plugs it just cranks but doesn't start.

I took off the two lines connected to the IP to see if fuel would squirt out. Nothing, I then checked the Stop solenoid and it was a bit sticky as the control arm did not move up when the plunger released it. I tried starting it with the control arm up but still no fuel coming out the IP.

Before I go about taking out the IP and messing with it, is there anything obvious that I am missing here that would prevent the IP from functioning properly?

Thanks guys!

 

[Robbied46]

This will probably sound really stupid to you but I saw it happen once. I was talking with a guy about a oo3a that was having a similar problem. It turned out the only problem was that the throttle was not pulled out. Forgive me for mentioning something so basic as you seem to be knowledgable about these units. Other than that, it sounds like a problem with the IP. Have you removed and cleaned the metering valve? These will sometimes get gummed up. Good luck on your project.

 

[1800 Diesel]

I see you put fuel in the lines, but did you actually bleed the air out of the system--all the way to the IP supply connection (at the IP inlet)?

Also, how long did you hold the pre-heat switch? This needs to be abt 45 seconds or a little longer if it's cold weather.

 

[DeucesWild11]

Robbied46, I did hold the throttle out in various different positions to see if there would be any change but nothing. Thanks, I will check the metering valve, (when I find it ) perhaps that is it.

1800 Diesel, I did not bleed out the air out of the system but I had the fuel pump running for a while and it was returning good fuel back. I'll check the IP to see where I can bleed it out. I did hold the pre-heat for about a minute and still no change and the generator has been in the garage for a few days 40-50 degrees, however I do know that's cold enough to need the pre-heater.

Thanks again!

 

[Robbied46]

There is a small screw located on top of the filter housings to bleed the air. It is the one in the center of another bolt.

 

[jbk]

if you dont get white smoke while cranking then your not getting fuel. does the linkage go all the way up while its cranking? if yes then you probally have a stuck plunger. i just had a 002 and 003 that had this problem. you might get lucky and free it and it works. i got the 003 running good now by freeing the plunger. theirs lots of past threads that deal with ip pump problems on these sets.

 

[storeman]

I agree with Jim (JBK). If plunger is broken, I may be able to help you.
Jerry

 

[1800 Diesel]

Robbied46, I did hold the throttle out in various different positions to see if there would be any change but nothing. Thanks, I will check the metering valve, (when I find it ) perhaps that is it.

1800 Diesel, I did not bleed out the air out of the system but I had the fuel pump running for a while and it was returning good fuel back. I'll check the IP to see where I can bleed it out. I did hold the pre-heat for about a minute and still no change and the generator has been in the garage for a few days 40-50 degrees, however I do know that's cold enough to need the pre-heater.

Thanks again!

You don't really need to crack the vents on top of the filter housings if you loosen the fuel supply line going into the IP. Place the end of the hose into a gallon jug or something & run the fuel pumps until you get good clean fuel & with no bubbles. Won't hurt to run the pump a couple minutes to verify all air is cleared from the filters. This also lets you see the fuel quality heading into the IP. At this point reconnect the hose fitting to the IP inlet and try cranking again. Remember the pre-heat must be done for 45 seconds or so, a little longer in cold weather. If you haven't already done so you need to verify the pre-heat system is working. I'm sure there's plenty of threads on that subject here on SS... As jbk said--no smoke during cranking means no fuel is being fed from the IP to the injectors and into the engine & then you're missing one of the five components needed for the MEP2 & 3 models to have a good light-off....

 

[DeucesWild11]

Yeah no white smoke or anything. I took off the IP tonight and noticed that the Plunger Sleeve was stuck, I freed that up but not sure if the plunger itself is also supposed to be moving. I am planning on taking off the Delivery Valve Holder next to see if something is stuck up in there but that will be most likely over the weekend.

One question I have though is the Plunger Sleeve, does that just move up and down on the plunger and cover or uncover the little hole on the plunger?

Thanks again guys!

 

[LuckyDog]

My guess, since the plunger was stuck, is the plunger guide is busted.
That was my experience. You can read the whole story here: http://www.steelsoldiers.com/showth...P-You-guys-that-have-taken-em-apart&highlight=

Enjoy.

 

[DeucesWild11]

Thanks for the Link LuckyDog, good reading, I plan on breaking down the IP a little more this weekend to see if the plunger is busted or not and if I can free it up.

 

[glcaines]

I had almost the exact same experience with my 003a. After cleaning the fuel tank, lines and filters, it wouldn't start. Wouldn't even fire. I bled the air as per instructions, and still nothing. I finally loosened all fuel lines to the injectors and cranked until fuel came out of each line. It took over a minute of cranking. Afterwards, the unit ran like new.

 

[Grega]

Like glcaines said,crack the lines on the front of the pump, if no fuel while cranking the pump it will probably need to be disassembled and cleaned up. Usually the plunger gets stuck in the guide and will have to get a new guide from ambac or other places. You may or may not need a seal kit. I was a little skeptical about taking the pump apart but this online manual was helpfull. There were not too many pages so it was easy to just print off. Hope it helps... http://www.ambac.net/images/Diese_Fuel_Injection_Pump.pdf

 

[DeucesWild11]

Thanks guys! I determined my IP was bad as no fuel was coming out of the IP to the injectors. Thank you to GimpyRobb for supplying me with a new IP! I got it running last night with allot of white smoke and a little grey smoke as well. I also had what I call engine knocking, didn't sound too good but I also only had it running for less than a minute since the garage doors were closed. Once I opened them and aired out my garage I tried cranking again but the batteries were worn down so I am going to try again tonight.

Is the knocking/smoke normal for startup? I think it has been sitting for some time now so I am hoping it just has to blow some garbage out of the lines or something.

Thanks again your help was much appreciated!

 

[Triple Jim]

If I preheat with the glow plugs properly, my 003A starts and runs cleanly in a few seconds. It sounds like either your glow plugs aren't working or your injector pump may not be set up properly. Did you follow the timing procedure when you put the new one on?

 

[DeucesWild11]

The way I understood the timing instructions. I turned the flywheel until the needle lined up with the "PC" mark. Then I opened the screw on the side of the IP and turned the IP till I could lock it in place with a small copper pin. Bolted the IP to the block and that was it. Did I miss anything??

Also the IP was matched with a button to come to almost the exact same number as the old one.

 

[storeman]

Sounds like you are on the right track. Next step is glow plug functionality, then valve adjustment, then injectors.
Jerry

 

[DeucesWild11]

Thanks, I took video of it running tonight and the sound it was making, I hope to be able to upload it tomorrow so you all can see and hear what I am talking about. I am also concerned now about the oil. I did an oil change when I first got her, checking the oil now it seems it's a bit thinned out as if diesel may be mixing with it somehow.. I hope it's not.. ever hear of such a thing? It just seems more "watery" and drips off the dip stick real fast, it's hard to get a good reading on it now.

 

[glcaines]

Thanks, I took video of it running tonight and the sound it was making, I hope to be able to upload it tomorrow so you all can see and hear what I am talking about. I am also concerned now about the oil. I did an oil change when I first got her, checking the oil now it seems it's a bit thinned out as if diesel may be mixing with it somehow.. I hope it's not.. ever hear of such a thing? It just seems more "watery" and drips off the dip stick real fast, it's hard to get a good reading on it now.

I've never heard of this on an 003A, but that doesn't necessarily mean anything. Usually if you drain a little bit of oil into a container you can smell the diesel fuel in it if diesel is getting into the oil on a diesel engine.

 

[DeucesWild11]

OK guys here is a clip of the unit running (poorly) I may drain the oil again and re-fill to see if it gets thinned out again. Not sure where to go from here. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQ2r0UsbDhI&feature=youtu.be