MEP-002A, will Start, Run then dies....any suggestions?

[1FAST4]

I put the pump stack all together and took it out the Gen Set for the 24v to test the pumps. I pulled the fuel draw tube/fitting and hose from the day tank and put the draw tube into a fresh 2 1/2 gallon tank of Diesel. I then connected the tank's draw hose to each pump inlet, one at a time, to test flow and PSI; I used the hose from the "Aux pump to Tank" to pump the fuel from the outlet of each pump into a "new" 2 gallon bucket. I also only supplied power to one pump at a time.

Here's what I found.
Pump 1: When Master switch was turned to Prime Run the Pump started. It ran for about 20 seconds with a small amount fuel and a few flakes of varnish coming out, then the pump stopped and would not restart. When I turned the Master Switch off then back to Prime the pump would pulse one time then stop. I think it got clogged up with something. I'll disassemble it tomorrow and take a look. This pump was running fine a few days ago when I tested the flow and PSI.

Pump 2: When Master switch was turned to Prime the Pump started. I ran it for about a minute and a half; It produced a solid stream of fuel that had a few dark granules in it but then cleared. It had a solid 6.5 PSI.

Aux Pump: When Master switch was turned to Prime-Aux the Pump started. I ran it for about a minute, but no fuel came out. Tried again same result, no fuel coming out. I removed the Aux Fuel Solenoid and saw no fuel in the chamber or fitting. I then connected a flare fitting directly to the pump's outlet and tried again. This time it ran it for about a minute and a half; It produced a solid stream of fuel that had a few dark granules in it but then cleared. It too had a solid 6.5 PSI.

I have never used the Aux fuel system since I got the Gen Set back in 2013 and who knows when it was last used before that. My guess is it's froze. I now the Solenoid are available on eBay for about $50 but I'd like to open it up and see if I can get it working but, I can't find any diagrams or disassemble instructions. Have any of you guys torn into one of these? If so, could you give me some guidance?

Also, I noticed none of the pumps would run (no power) unless the harness was plugged into the Aux Fuel Solenoid, is this normal?

One thing I did forget to do was blow out the hoses before I connected them to the pump...maybe the reason for the stoppage on Pump 1...hum?

Rick, wish I would of look at you post before I started this morning....

 

[Scoobyshep]

I put the pump stack all together and took it out the Gen Set for the 24v to test the pumps. I pulled the fuel draw tube/fitting and hose from the day tank and put the draw tube into a fresh 2 1/2 gallon tank of Diesel. I then connected the tank's draw hose to each pump inlet, one at a time, to test flow and PSI; I used the hose from the tank to Aux pump to pump the fuel from the outlet of each pump into a "new" 2 gallon bucket. I also only supplied power to one pump at a time.

Here's what I found.
Pump 1: When Master switch was turned to Prime Run the Pump started. It ran for about 20 seconds with a small amount fuel and a few flakes of varnish coming out, then the pump stopped and would not restart. When I turned the Master Switch off then back to Prime the pump would pulse one time then stop. I think it got clogged up with something. I'll disassemble it tomorrow and take a look.

Pump 2: When Master switch was turned to Prime the Pump started. I ran it for about a minute and a half; It produced a solid stream of fuel that had a few dark granules in it but then cleared. It had a solid 6.5 PSI.

Aux Pump: When Master switch was turned to Prime-Aux the Pump started. I ran it for about a minute, but no fuel came out. Tried again same result, no fuel coming out. I removed the Aux Fuel Solenoid and saw no fuel in the chamber or fitting. I then connected a flare fitting directly to the pump's outlet and tried again. This time it ran it for about a minute and a half; It produced a solid stream of fuel that had a few dark granules in it but then cleared. It too had a solid 6.5 PSI.

I have never used the Aux fuel system since I got the Gen Set back in 2013 and who knows when it was last used before that. My guess is it's froze. I now the Solenoid are available on eBay for about $50 but I'd like to open it up and see if I can get it working but, I can't find any diagrams or disassemble instructions. Have any of you guys torn into one of these? If so, could you give me some guidance?

Also, I noticed none of the pumps would run (no power) unless the harness was plugged into the Aux Fuel Solenoid, is this normal?

 

[Scoobyshep]

How did you ground the pumps? The solenoid connection might have been providing a ground path

 

[1FAST4]

How did you ground the pumps? The solenoid connection might have been providing a ground path

Used a grounding lead from new "temp" bolt through frame hole to a new bolt, star washer, washer, nut through the pump mount and mounting plate hole. Had good continuity at all points.

 

[Scoobyshep]

Used a grounding lead from new "temp" bolt through frame hole to a new bolt, star washer, washer, nut through the pump mount and mounting plate hole. Had good continuity at all points.

If you had a good ground the pump should run when connected and in prime\run. Unless you have the wrong pump lead connected

 

[Guyfang]

You did apply 24 VDC to the solenoid, right? Thats the only way it will pass fuel when the AUX system is used.

 

[rickf]

I am a bit confused about the line connections. The aux pump will not pump any fuel if it is not connected to and external fuel source. Hooking a line up to the outlet should in no way get fuel out of the pump. Several things here have me confused. The fact you are getting varnish out of the lines tells me the condition of the fuel circuit needs to be improved. And if pump #1 stopped like it was seized then you need to make sure it was put together correctly. The filter screen would stop anything big enough to jam the plunger before it got that far and the pump would still run but possibly not pull fuel past the clogged filter. If the pump is jammed up then it probably has to do with the reassembly. Did you remove the capacitors as has been suggested?

 

[1FAST4]

If you had a good ground the pump should run when connected and in prime\run. Unless you have the wrong pump lead connected

All pumps ran when connected to their respective incoming power leads. All were labeled before I disconnected them. I am going to set up a couple of 12v batteries in series to make it easier test them on my work bench.

 

[1FAST4]

You did apply 24 VDC to the solenoid, right? Thats the only way it will pass fuel when the AUX system is used.

I connected the three pin connector to the solenoid and the single (rubber plug) lead to the pump then turned the Master Switch to Prime Aux. Pump ran but solenoid did not open to let the fuel out.

 

[Guyfang]

If you are careful, you can apply 24VDC directly to the Solenoid. It should click. If not, you need to take it apart, and clean it. Clicking doesn't mean it works. but if you can not hear or feel it open then look at it. When the whole rig is connected to the set, you can see if it works by Applying 24 VDC to TB4-6 and TB4-11 and then hooking E1 up to a fuel source. Apply power and the E1 should pump fuel into the fuel tank, as long as its empty or S3 is closed.

 

[1FAST4]

I am a bit confused about the line connections. The aux pump will not pump any fuel if it is not connected to and external fuel source. Hooking a line up to the outlet should in no way get fuel out of the pump. Several things here have me confused. The fact you are getting varnish out of the lines tells me the condition of the fuel circuit needs to be improved. And if pump #1 stopped like it was seized then you need to make sure it was put together correctly. The filter screen would stop anything big enough to jam the plunger before it got that far and the pump would still run but possibly not pull fuel past the clogged filter. If the pump is jammed up then it probably has to do with the reassembly. Did you remove the capacitors as has been suggested?

I completely removed the "Tank to Main Pump" fuel hose and the "Aux pump to Tank" fuel hose from the Gen Set. I used these two hoses to set a fuel circuit independent of the Gen Set. For testing, the "Tank to Main Pump" fuel hose was used to draw fresh diesel from a 2 1/2 gallon fuel can which was supplied to the inlet of each pump. The "Aux pump to Tank" fuel hose was used to connect to the outlet of each pump where the "waste" fuel was sent to a 2 gallon bucket. The Gen Set was only us to supply power to the pumps for testing. I will be pulling Pump 1 apart today to take a look.

As I mentioned, I did NOT clean/blow out the "Tank to Main Pump" fuel hose and the "Aux pump to Tank" fuel hose that I used for the fuel circuit...I just forgot.

And yes, all the capacitors were removed.

 

[1FAST4]

If you are careful, you can apply 24VDC directly to the Solenoid. It should click. If not, you need to take it apart, and clean it. Clicking doesn't mean it works. but if you can not hear or feel it open then look at it. When the whole rig is connected to the set, you can see if it works by Applying 24 VDC to TB4-6 and TB4-11 and then hooking E1 up to a fuel source. Apply power and the E1 should pump fuel into the fuel tank, as long as its empty or S3 is closed.

View attachment 938894

Can you show me on the attached pic which pins on the solenoid do I apply 24v power to to see if it clicks?

Also, do you have any instructions/diagrams on how to disassemble the soleniod? I started a new thread here "Solenoid Disassemble" on the solenoid disassemble just in case someone who's not following this thread wants to chime in.

 

[rickf]

Ok, But you need the Aux in line in the tank of fuel and the aux out line into a can. This is the only way that pump will pump fuel. If the onboard tank is empty then the solenoid should click and allow the pump to pick up fuel. That pump is not tied into the main fuel circuit in any way, it only pumps from an external source into the onboard tank.

 

[rickf]

You could just unscrew the solenoid off of the pump and put the inlet line on the pump there and test as you were. This eliminates the solenoid for testing. But again, that inlet line needs to go to the source of the fuel, in the can.

 

[Guyfang]

Can you show me on the attached pic which pins on the solenoid do I apply 24v power to to see if it clicks?
The Aux Fuel solenoid is called K4. The C-Plug that screws into the K4 is J5. You want pins J5-A and J5-B. Look into the plug, both sides for that matter. It should have the A&B marked clearly. If I remember right, its the two pins on the left side of your picture. BUT do not trust my moth eaten brain. Look!!

Also, do you have any instructions/diagrams on how to disassemble the soleniod? (Just wing it. Its only a few parts. Test first.) I started a new thread here "Solenoid Disassemble" on the solenoid disassemble just in case someone who's not following this thread wants to chime in.
This is called Cross posting. It is not allowed to post the same problem in two different threads. I will nuke that thread.

 

[1FAST4]

This is called Cross posting. It is not allowed to post the same problem in two different threads. I will nuke that thread.

Oh, Sorry...I just thought that if someone had an issue with the Aux Fuel Solenoid specifically, they could just search for that term, and it would be easier than having to read every post that mentions "Solenoid". Again, sorry about that!!!

 

[1FAST4]

Ok, But you need the Aux in line in the tank of fuel and the aux out line into a can.

This is how I have it setup.

 

[1FAST4]

You could just unscrew the solenoid off of the pump and put the inlet line on the pump there and test as you were. This eliminates the solenoid for testing. But again, that inlet line needs to go to the source of the fuel, in the can.

Already did this. Pump worked fine...see Post#101

 

[1FAST4]

Ok, found the issue with the Aux Fuel Solenoid; I had not yet reinstalled the Day tank after cleaning, so the Aux Fuel Float was not in (connected) the Aux Fuel circuit. Once connected, the Aux pump and solenoid operated correctly...pump would push fuel when the float was down and stop when the float was raised up to the stop ring. One issue solved.

Pump 1 Issue: I disassembled the pump but did not see anything that would cause it to stop pumping and everything was assembled the same as the other two working pumps. I cleaned it again, reassembled and bench tested it without any fuel...It ran for a good 3 mins without issue. I then added fuel lines with fuel and tested again; as it built pressure a solid stream of fuel started to flow then it just stopped...see attached "Vid-1". I disconnected and reconnected power and the pump would pulse 1 or 2 times but that was it. I then connected the pressure gauge to the pump outlet and powered it up. The pump built pressure to about 6.5 PSI then stopped pumping, as the pressure started to drop the pump would pulse one or two time and that was it...the the few pulses was not enough to build or maint pressure...see attached "Vid-2". I rapidly disconnected and reconnected power and the same thing happened, one or two pluses and that was it...see attached "Vid-3".

I then disconnected the fuel hoses and tiped the pump from end to end to get as much fuel out a possible to run another dry bench test. On the bench with no fuel the pump ran without issue for 5+ minutes...see attached "Vid-4". At this point I have no idea why to pump stops when it seems to start building pressure

What do you guys think?????

 

[Scoobyshep]

Ok, found the issue with the Aux Fuel Solenoid; I had not yet reinstalled the Day tank after cleaning, so the Aux Fuel Float was not in (connected) the Aux Fuel circuit. Once connected, the Aux pump and solenoid operated correctly...pump would push fuel when the float was down and stop when the float was raised up to the stop ring. One issue solved.

Pump 1 Issue: I disassembled the pump but did not see anything that would cause it to stop pumping and everything was assembled the same as the other two working pumps. I cleaned it again, reassembled and bench tested it without any fuel...It ran for a good 3 mins without issue. I then added fuel lines with fuel and tested again; as it built pressure a solid stream of fuel started to flow then it just stopped...see attached "Vid-1". I disconnected and reconnected power and the pump would pulse 1 or 2 times but that was it. I then connected the pressure gauge to the pump outlet and powered it up. The pump built pressure to about 6.5 PSI then stopped pumping, as the pressure started to drop the pump would pulse one or two time and that was it...the the few pulses was not enough to build or maint pressure...see attached "Vid-2". I rapidly disconnected and reconnected power and the same thing happened, one or two pluses and that was it...see attached "Vid-3".

I then disconnected the fuel hoses and tiped the pump from end to end to get as much fuel out a possible to run another dry bench test. On the bench with no fuel the pump ran without issue for 5+ minutes...see attached "Vid-4". At this point I have no idea why to pump stops when it seems to start building pressure

What do you guys think?????

Need access for the videos, but quickly just off the top of my head is your stopping pumping at pressure just clicking really slow?