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My MEP-803a experience

lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I went ahead and ordered a 24v relay and pigtail so the battery tender will automatically disconnect from the batteries.

Relay
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KA4F0GE/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Pigtail
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002Q80RW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I've also gotten my 100 gallon fuel tank installed and plumbed, filled to about 80-90 gallons so far. I transferred my 55 gallon drum, and 3 loads of 2x5 gallon containers, but it has run some. All fuel has been treated with Pri-D.

Pics to come.
 

smokem joe

Active member
499
68
28
Location
Green OH
I went ahead and ordered a 24v relay and pigtail so the battery tender will automatically disconnect from the batteries.

Relay
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01KA4F0GE/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Pigtail
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002Q80RW/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

I've also gotten my 100 gallon fuel tank installed and plumbed, filled to about 80-90 gallons so far. I transferred my 55 gallon drum, and 3 loads of 2x5 gallon containers, but it has run some. All fuel has been treated with Pri-D.

Pics to come.
I'd be real curious on how you wire this up. I was thinking the other day that I'd like to come up with a way to accomplish this.
 

lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I'd be real curious on how you wire this up. I was thinking the other day that I'd like to come up with a way to accomplish this.
I plan to pull the trigger off of pin 3 of the Master Switch, which I think is hot in start and run. The inputs on the relay will be the positive and negative of the battery tender output, the output of the relay will go to the batteries. For convenience, I connected my battery tender output to the slave port. It should be as simple as cutting the pigtail in half, one half to the relay inputs the other to the outputs and insert in line with the battery tender output. This should isolate the battery tender from any voltage generated by the alternator to the batteries.

Edit: Confirmed there is voltage on pin 3 in start and run, though it did drop from 26v to 20v in the start position. I'll see if that is below the coil break voltage. Also, I'm going to go from the alternator excitation terminal(connected to pin 3) for the trigger.
 
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kloppk

Well-known member
Steel Soldiers Supporter
2,126
3,490
113
Location
Pepperell, Massachusetts
... it did drop from 26v to 20v in the start position. I'll see if that is below the coil break voltage.
Dropout voltage for a HH52P series relay is 10% of rated DC coil voltage which is 2.4 V. Ought to be good.

Might want to secure the relay to the socket so it doesn't vibrate out. I don't see a locking bale on it.
 
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lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I wired up the relay last night, and there really isn't much to it. No real point in taking a picture of the setup, but here is the wiring diagram in M$ Paint. I verified that it does work to cut out the tender when 24v is supplied to pin 14. I didn't have time to run a wire from the alternator yet, but will next time I have a few minutes to spare.

One thing to note, is that you can use pins 8 and 5 to get a switched 24v that would only be active in Start and Run if you had need for a switched power source. Just be sure that your power requirements are not greater than 7.5amps which is the fuse size supplied by Battery Tender.
 

Attachments

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lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I can confirm that my automatic disconnect does work. I've got materials enough to make 2 more if anyone is interested.

We were in the path of hurricane Michael and I just finished running the generator for 100 hours with only one break of 2 hours in the middle. It performed flawlessly, never seemed to struggle, and was virtually silent from inside the house. Life was pretty much normal, except for no internet for two days. We were down for a little more than 4 days. I cranked it up to function check the two days leading up to the hit, and again about an hour after we lost power. My wife was very happy that I decided to get as big a generator as I did. 80 degrees inside is too hot for her, so the AC was a life saver.

I believe I have a leak in the fuel return line, which seems to be fairly common with these. I'll dig into the threads here and get that fixed.
 

csheath

Active member
714
213
43
Location
FL
I can confirm that my automatic disconnect does work. I've got materials enough to make 2 more if anyone is interested.

We were in the path of hurricane Michael and I just finished running the generator for 100 hours with only one break of 2 hours in the middle. It performed flawlessly, never seemed to struggle, and was virtually silent from inside the house. Life was pretty much normal, except for no internet for two days. We were down for a little more than 4 days. I cranked it up to function check the two days leading up to the hit, and again about an hour after we lost power. My wife was very happy that I decided to get as big a generator as I did. 80 degrees inside is too hot for her, so the AC was a life saver.

I believe I have a leak in the fuel return line, which seems to be fairly common with these. I'll dig into the threads here and get that fixed.
Glad you came through the storm okay.

Let me know if you want any help with the return lines. I used Gates fuel line that was in stock at O'Rilley Auto Parts. The 1/8" (3.2mm) is part number 27000 and the 1/4" is 27002. Both were $1.39 per foot. It was a snug fit and seems like it should work as least as well as the original. In all my years working on European cars that braided fuel line would always leak before you thought it should. I think the Gates fuel line is MUCH higher quality. Had to remove the top panel and the panel at the fuel tank to replace all of it. On the short 1/4" lines at the pumps you have to cut the crimped metal off to remove the hose. A vise and hacksaw will work for that. You could probably get by without clamping those but I used fuel injection type band clamps on mine. The small line just pushes on.

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IMG_1376.JPG

IMG_1378.JPG

IMG_1379.JPG
 

smokem joe

Active member
499
68
28
Location
Green OH
I also use the gates hoses on my units. In my opinion it is a much higher quality hose. I have used Gates hoses for years on anything I work on and have yet to have one fail<br>
 

lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
Power is out again, which allowed me to confirm that the return line is leaking. A steady drip now. Glad that I built in the secondary feed for the backup-backup generator. Picking up hose tomorrow.

How much of the 1/8 and 1/4 did you need?
 
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smokem joe

Active member
499
68
28
Location
Green OH
I think I used around 2' of 1/4" line and 12' of 1/8". 3' of 1/4 will do you for sure. I bought the 1/8 by the roll when I was going through units so not positive. I'd get two units out of one 25' roll though.
 

csheath

Active member
714
213
43
Location
FL
Power is out again, which allowed me to confirm that the return line is leaking. A steady drip now. Glad that I built in the secondary feed for the backup-backup generator. Picking up hose tomorrow.

How much of the 1/8 and 1/4 did you need?
Just looked at my receipt and I bought 11' of 1/8" and 2' of 1/4" and had plenty. If you want to clamp the 1/4" hoses you can use zip ties.
 

NormB

Well-known member
1,220
72
48
Location
Cloverly,MD
anyone have a link or part number for the correct rivnut/captive nuts to replace the nut/bolts for the top cover?

What smokem joe said.

You shouldn’t put riv nuts in those places. Alignment’s not going to work out for all of ‘em when you try to assemble things.

Notice the square captive nuts in many places have some play in the design to avoid this.
 

lonesouth

Active member
322
29
28
Location
Tallahassee, FL
I tackled this last night. Soup to nuts, took about 3 hours. My 803 is a 2000 non-reset unit, so most of the nuts are not caged. I went ahead and installed rivnuts, which led to a little extra work that is not necessary to complete the fuel line repair. Here is some of what I did:

1. remove all of the bolts from the rear panel to get access to the fuel tank to remove/connect the old/new fuel return line
- the bolts along the bottom have nuts on the back side, all other nuts are caged
2. remove all of the bolts from the top cover
- all bolts going into the radiator area are caged
- most others came off using an light weight impact driver and holding the nut with my fingers
3. remove front top cover to get access to the support that the front and rear top cover mount to
- there are only about 10 bolts to get this off, one of them is caged, the rest are bolt and nut
- the panel cover has to come off and most of the screws broke off while attempting to remove them

With all of these covers off, locating and removing the fuel return line is easy. My old fuel line pulled apart and came out easily. Getting the old hose off of the Tees required a little more effort, though. I simply took the section of Tees out as a whole line, and rebuilt it on my workbench using the 3.2mm gates hose. The hose was rather tight and I used some WD-40 to lubricate the ends while reassembling. I also had to use a towel and a air of pliers to hold and twist each piece to a secure connection. No hose clamps are required. Once pieced together, I strung the new Tee section back on top of the engine and, using WD-40 again, was able to put the hose onto the return barbs. After getting all the hose connected, I fired up the generator and watched for 5 minutes to verify that there were no leaks.

With all of the panels off, I was easily able to install the rivnuts. I used Astro Pneumatics 1442 rivnut setter, with a 10-32A mandrel to install the aluminum rivnuts. You will want to use aluminum rivnuts to avoid galvanic corrosion(dissimilar metals). For bolts, I reinstalled the original bolts as they are, I believe, plated to prevent galvanic corrosion. I stripped a few, and broke many of the screws that attach the control panel cover and will be replacing those with zinc plated 10-32 bolts/cap head screws. From what I've gathered, zinc has a lower instance of galvanic corrosion with aluminum, and the plating prevents the steel from contacting the rivnut.

When installing the rivnuts, I found that installing the rivnut on the tool fully would make it easy to over-pull the rivnut, essentially stripping out the treads. The easy fix is to thread the rivnut onto the mandrel until only a few threads are still uncovered. This limits the full pull of the tool and still creates a strong bond on the rivnut. It did take some trial and error, but I had the process down after the third one. There were a handful of places where I could not install a rivnut due to the mounting hole interfacing with multiple panels, most notably on the front top cover, in which laces I simply reinstalled the bolt and nut.

All said and done, from disassembly to fully reassembled, I finished this project in roughly three hours. I had put it off for fear of the hundreds of nuts and bolts that would be impossible to reach. After going through it, it is perhaps 40 total nuts and bolts to attack, many of the nuts are caged and therefore not a real problem. I suspect going back with nuts and bolts would have taken much longer than using rivnuts, though. The 1442 tool is overkill for aluminum 10-32 rivnuts, and you can easily strip them out, but it is easy to learn how to do it properly. I have other uses for the tool with larger rivnuts, so that is why I went with it. If you are just wanting to install rivnuts on your MEP, you should be able to get by with either a cheaper, lighter-duty, setter, or just use the bolt/nut/lockwasher method which is well documented in numerous youtube videos.

Alignment wasn't really an issue, though I may have gotten lucky.
 

Another Ahab

Well-known member
17,989
4,532
113
Location
Alexandria, VA
I tackled this last night. Soup to nuts, took about 3 hours.

When installing the rivnuts, I found that installing the rivnut on the tool fully would make it easy to over-pull the rivnut, essentially stripping out the treads. The easy fix is to thread the rivnut onto the mandrel until only a few threads are still uncovered. This limits the full pull of the tool and still creates a strong bond on the rivnut. It did take some trial and error, but I had the process down after the third one. There were a handful of places where I could not install a rivnut due to the mounting hole interfacing with multiple panels, most notably on the front top cover, in which laces I simply reinstalled the bolt and nut.
The learning curve is crucial to success of any project. It's the part you never (rarely) get from any manual (though you wish you would).
 

Guyfang

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
16,656
23,793
113
Location
Burgkunstadt, Germany
I tackled this last night. Soup to nuts, took about 3 hours. My 803 is a 2000 non-reset unit, so most of the nuts are not caged. I went ahead and installed rivnuts, which led to a little extra work that is not necessary to complete the fuel line repair. Here is some of what I did:

1. remove all of the bolts from the rear panel to get access to the fuel tank to remove/connect the old/new fuel return line
- the bolts along the bottom have nuts on the back side, all other nuts are caged
2. remove all of the bolts from the top cover
- all bolts going into the radiator area are caged
- most others came off using an light weight impact driver and holding the nut with my fingers
3. remove front top cover to get access to the support that the front and rear top cover mount to
- there are only about 10 bolts to get this off, one of them is caged, the rest are bolt and nut
- the panel cover has to come off and most of the screws broke off while attempting to remove them

With all of these covers off, locating and removing the fuel return line is easy. My old fuel line pulled apart and came out easily. Getting the old hose off of the Tees required a little more effort, though. I simply took the section of Tees out as a whole line, and rebuilt it on my workbench using the 3.2mm gates hose. The hose was rather tight and I used some WD-40 to lubricate the ends while reassembling. I also had to use a towel and a air of pliers to hold and twist each piece to a secure connection. No hose clamps are required. Once pieced together, I strung the new Tee section back on top of the engine and, using WD-40 again, was able to put the hose onto the return barbs. After getting all the hose connected, I fired up the generator and watched for 5 minutes to verify that there were no leaks.

With all of the panels off, I was easily able to install the rivnuts. I used Astro Pneumatics 1442 rivnut setter, with a 10-32A mandrel to install the aluminum rivnuts. You will want to use aluminum rivnuts to avoid galvanic corrosion(dissimilar metals). For bolts, I reinstalled the original bolts as they are, I believe, plated to prevent galvanic corrosion. I stripped a few, and broke many of the screws that attach the control panel cover and will be replacing those with zinc plated 10-32 bolts/cap head screws. From what I've gathered, zinc has a lower instance of galvanic corrosion with aluminum, and the plating prevents the steel from contacting the rivnut.

When installing the rivnuts, I found that installing the rivnut on the tool fully would make it easy to over-pull the rivnut, essentially stripping out the treads. The easy fix is to thread the rivnut onto the mandrel until only a few threads are still uncovered. This limits the full pull of the tool and still creates a strong bond on the rivnut. It did take some trial and error, but I had the process down after the third one. There were a handful of places where I could not install a rivnut due to the mounting hole interfacing with multiple panels, most notably on the front top cover, in which laces I simply reinstalled the bolt and nut.

All said and done, from disassembly to fully reassembled, I finished this project in roughly three hours. I had put it off for fear of the hundreds of nuts and bolts that would be impossible to reach. After going through it, it is perhaps 40 total nuts and bolts to attack, many of the nuts are caged and therefore not a real problem. I suspect going back with nuts and bolts would have taken much longer than using rivnuts, though. The 1442 tool is overkill for aluminum 10-32 rivnuts, and you can easily strip them out, but it is easy to learn how to do it properly. I have other uses for the tool with larger rivnuts, so that is why I went with it. If you are just wanting to install rivnuts on your MEP, you should be able to get by with either a cheaper, lighter-duty, setter, or just use the bolt/nut/lockwasher method which is well documented in numerous youtube videos.

Alignment wasn't really an issue, though I may have gotten lucky.

I keep telling everyone, this is not rocket science. Its best to read the book a bit, and take it slow. clean as you go. Lay everything out in a logical sequence. Take your time. Check everything twice, (at least) and reassemble. These machines were made to use and repair by people with little experience.

You done good!
 
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