New IP Issues Help

[2INSANE]

Hello! I bought a custom built DB2 IP from Badgerdiesel eBay because the old ip was leaking from the throttle seal. I installed the new ip and the M1009 fired right up but ran rough with white smoke with the ip timing set mark to mark. I advanced the timing as far as I could and it runs a lot better but still smokes a little and runs a tad choppy when cold.

My question is what would cause the ip to make it run better when advancing it all the way? I should not have to advance it soooo much right?

it has new injectors, new lift pump, new Gear drive.

Should I try and up the fuel on the ip?

 

[Barrman]

White smoke that is greasy normally means cold engine. Puffy white smoke means coolant in one or more cylinder. Pull the radiator cap while the engine is running and see if you are getting signs of combustion pressurizing the coolant.

 

[joshuak]

White smoke that is greasy normally means cold engine. Puffy white smoke means coolant in one or more cylinder. Pull the radiator cap while the engine is running and see if you are getting signs of combustion pressurizing the coolant.

Jumping on to 2insanes thread as I feel I'm in the same boat. If there are signs, what would be your recommended plan of action and how far would you take it?
ie, pressure test, replace head gasket, have heads magnafluxed, have block inspected...?

 

[Chaski]

When the engine is cold are you getting 12 power to the cold advance and high idle solenoids?

 

[Barrman]

I didn’t write enough in my response last night.

Yes a not working or not wired up cold start advance solenoid will cause a puff or two of dirty white smoke and an engine acting like it is mad you woke it up. But, at most it will last 20-30 seconds when the temperature is above 40° out. One of mine had the green wire knocked off the sensor on the lower rear passenger side and started that way a few days ago.

The original post mentioned a new IP and injectors. Injectors have different pop pressures depending on 6.2, 6.5 or 6.5 turbo. Yet a mix match will still let it run. I had a 6.5 with a rusted solid throttle shaft and a 6.2 of unknown status both in cans in my class. We did a very fast and dirty IP swap to see if the 6.5 might have life. It did. The worn out 6.2 IP leaked at the throttle shafts but no smoke and a smooth idle.

With that in mind. When I read about the rough idle and smoke. My first thought was head gasket. I have done multiple IP replacements and can not remember a single time where smoke of any kind happened. Maybe a puff of black on initial start.

how does the oil look? Any water in it?

I would suggest a cooling system pressure test with a cold engine. That will tell you of any seeps. If that holds pressure then pull the glow plugs and do a complete compression test of all 8. That will tell you of any leaks. Yet, if the coolant isn’t leaking. Where is the water for the white smoke coming from?

 

[2INSANE]

I did put this new ip on a different 6.2 and still had the same issues and ended up putting the old ip back on and the motor had no issues. I do not think it is a coolant leak because I did new head gaskets as well. I will test the cold advance. Other ideas?

 

[cucvrus]

New Head Gaskets are GREAT. Did you have the heads checked out at a machine shop? I may sound like a broken record. But doing it the right way the first time is the only way to call it done right. Cracked, warped heads are a common issue. I say common because I usually need 2 sets of heads to end up with 1 good set. And what ever you do replace the head bolts. They are a torque to yield and the only things that are good for after removed in scrap or a fishing sinker. Good Luck.

 

[2INSANE]

New Head Gaskets are GREAT. Did you have the heads checked out at a machine shop? I may sound like a broken record. But doing it the right way the first time is the only way to call it done right. Cracked, warped heads are a common issue. I say common because I usually need 2 sets of heads to end up with 1 good set. And what ever you do replace the head bolts. They are a torque to yield and the only things that are good for after removed in scrap or a fishing sinker. Good Luck.

I did not have a shop check the heads. The motor has 23,000 orig miles on it. I installed ARP Head Studs with the Arp thread sealer.,

Honestly I think it is the IP. I will replace it with the old one once I replace the throttle Seal.

 

[royalflush55]

I did put this new ip on a different 6.2 and still had the same issues and ended up putting the old ip back on and the motor had no issues. I do not think it is a coolant leak because I did new head gaskets as well. I will test the cold advance. Other ideas?

Here's your sign!

 

[2INSANE]

Here's your sign!

The thing is... How is it a custom built ip has to be advanced so much to get it to run decent? What would I have to do internally to fix the advancement?

 

[jnlperformance]

I reman the db2829, db2831 and ds4 series pumps.
Quick rundown on serial I'd

Db2831; 2 plunger, 8 cylinder, 31mm diameter plungers
2829; 2plunger, 8 cyl, 29mm
Ds4831; 4 plunger, 8 cyl, 31mm

The advance piston is likely not calibrated correctly. The advance piston armature assembly is what controls the roller cam position and the cam is what causes the plungers movement.

If you post a pic of the advance piston armature assembly on the passenger side of the pump I may be able to see how out it could be... or maybe the piston itself is having issues.

It should be tight but also should depress and return on it's own. The throttle shaft has a cam of sorts on it and the arm rolls up the cam as the throttle shaft moves. Make sure that cam is not worn. Its located on the top of the armature on the exterior of the pump.

The lower part of the armature has a Allen key adjustment as well. Hopefully that was left alone.

Turning the fuel up on a n/a 6.2 is unneccessary and I highly recommend not doing that. The only reason youd need to do that is if you added a turbocharger to it or lowered the engines overall compression from 21.5:1 to something lower (18,17.5,17 16:1 etc)

If you're suspicious of a blown hg then the upper radiator hose will get hard to squeeze shortly after startup... before the hose is actually warm. If you're running arps then its unlikely you blew an hg. But a hard rad hose and white smoke is indicative of a blown hg... and the loss of coolant in the reservoir...

hope this helps

 

[2INSANE]

I reman the db2829, db2831 and ds4 series pumps.
Quick rundown on serial I'd

Db2831; 2 plunger, 8 cylinder, 31mm diameter plungers
2829; 2plunger, 8 cyl, 29mm
Ds4831; 4 plunger, 8 cyl, 31mm

The advance piston is likely not calibrated correctly. The advance piston armature assembly is what controls the roller cam position and the cam is what causes the plungers movement.

If you post a pic of the advance piston armature assembly on the passenger side of the pump I may be able to see how out it could be... or maybe the piston itself is having issues.

It should be tight but also should depress and return on it's own. The throttle shaft has a cam of sorts on it and the arm rolls up the cam as the throttle shaft moves. Make sure that cam is not worn. Its located on the top of the armature on the exterior of the pump.

The lower part of the armature has a Allen key adjustment as well. Hopefully that was left alone.

Turning the fuel up on a n/a 6.2 is unneccessary and I highly recommend not doing that. The only reason youd need to do that is if you added a turbocharger to it or lowered the engines overall compression from 21.5:1 to something lower (18,17.5,17 16:1 etc)

If you're suspicious of a blown hg then the upper radiator hose will get hard to squeeze shortly after startup... before the hose is actually warm. If you're running arps then its unlikely you blew an hg. But a hard rad hose and white smoke is indicative of a blown hg... and the loss of coolant in the reservoir...

hope this helps

Yes that is very helpful! The new pump is a DB2-4544. Isn’t that a 6.5 pump?

Old pump is a DB2-2829. I just replaced the leaking rubber O rings on the throttle.

No loss in the coolant levels.

 

[jnlperformance]

Negative. 6.2.

DB2829-4544
P/N:23500346
Platform:1986-88 HD C/K & P Truck
Injector - 84 mm length, 6 mm dia. nozzle valve; Lines - 2.50 mm I.D.; Delivery Valve Retraction - 30mm3


6.5s use db2831 series OR ds4831 series. 31mm diameter plungers. Db is 2 plunger. Ds is 4 plunger.


You CAN however turn the fuel up and change the advance piston calibration. But 29mm plungers are physically incapable of delivering the same amount of fuel as a 31mm plunger.