Sherpa winch vs PTO winch

[Floridianson]

I am thinking maybe I need to be checked for Alzheimer's because I can not remember a long post but I remember the Girls in Vegas 40 years ago. Good thing what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas and a rear winch is a good thing. Sometimes it is better to get pulled out the way you came in if the muck only get deeper. I forget but have a excuse what foreign truck had the winch that was run so it could be used from the front or the back?

 

[Recovry4x4]

I think Mogs have that.

 

[MudMarine]

I have a Warn M-series 18K on the rear of my truck, but I'd kind of like to buy one of the Sherpas and try it. They're a very competitive price point.

My junker:

View attachment 753156View attachment 753157View attachment 753158

That is a good looking setup!

 

[Swamp Donkey]

I am thinking maybe I need to be checked for Alzheimer's because I can not remember a long post but I remember the Girls in Vegas 40 years ago. Good thing what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas and a rear winch is a good thing. Sometimes it is better to get pulled out the way you came in if the muck only get deeper. I forget but have a excuse what foreign truck had the winch that was run so it could be used from the front or the back?

That Tatra that came to the Georgia Rally the other year from Canada had that as well. I know you saw that one. The spool was mounted in the center of the truck between the frame rails and could pull from the front or back depending on where you run the cable.

 

[sandcobra164]

Whatever you choose several properly rated Crosby shackles and at minimum 2 properly rated snatch blocks are a must for a big truck recovery.

Single lining on a big truck is a bad idea no matter what winch you choose. Use your winch in its best configuration on the last or next to the last layer on the drum and get all of the mechanical advantage from your recovery gear you can.


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I agree with most of your thoughts except in my usual situation. If you have a 60K rear winch, single lining is okay and you don't have to worry much about which wrap of the drum you are on. I've never had to use a snatch block on my M984A4. Even when an MTV was mired so deep in mud that the doors couldn't open and the crew had to exit through the windows. My 1089A1P2's have twin 30K winches and could have possibly done the job as well. "My" should be interpreted loosely, these trucks belong to the National Guard and can you believe they pay me to have this kind of fun!

 

[clinto]

I forget but have a excuse what foreign truck had the winch that was run so it could be used from the front or the back?

90% sure Tatras are that way, the Tatra driven from Canada to the GMVR a couple years ago had a midships mounted winch that could feet to the front or rear. I think the MTV winches are that way. HEMTTs maybe?

That is a good looking setup!

Thanks. I put a lot of thought into it. I didn't want to lose departure angle, I wanted it to be usable for self recovery and pulling dead vehicles onto trailers. I didn't want to have to swap the hitch or modify it by dropping it down any. I didn't want to hack the truck up (it killed me to drill the holes in the bottom of the frame for the crossmember) in order to mount it, didn't want to lose the stock pintle functionality, etc.

I rough drafted it on paper, thought it through, bounced ideas off a dozen of my friends whose opinions I trust and then mocked it up with wood and cardboard.

There's an entire album of how I did it here: https://imgur.com/a/y8WKT

The fairlead mount is 1/2" plate and attaches under the pintle. The factory fairlead wouldn't fit on the winch and was too tall to fit between the pintle and hitch. When I removed the stock fairlead, I had the fab shop make a spacer plate to replace the fairlead.

Got the winch at a very good deal (I should have bought two) but it was still expensive. Maybe $1200 at the low end, $1500 at the high end. Cut no corners: 00 welding cable, 350A disconnects, etc.

Tight fit with that rear crossmember. A lot of measuring went into this.



The fairlead mount took the most time. I think if that 1/2" plate had been 33/64" the pintle shaft would have been two short to get the cotter pin in.



Pintle retains 100% of factory capability. Rotates 360°, opens inverted, etc.



Winch brace

 

[MudMarine]

Wow yeah that looks beautiful! The civilian reciever, winch and pintle compliment each other nicely for sure.

I may end up doing something similar. I was debating designing a roller setup for the front bumper if I go with a front mounted Sherpa. I really wish I had this truck a few years ago when I was deployed to Australia, I'd've flown a few of these winches home and saved some shipping!

While I'm still tempted to go front PTO, I'm still thinking it's not the best option. Especially with making maintenance a little tougher and being more of a two person operation.

 

[Dock Rocker]

I agree with most of your thoughts except in my usual situation. If you have a 60K rear winch, single lining is okay and you don't have to worry much about which wrap of the drum you are on. I've never had to use a snatch block on my M984A4. Even when an MTV was mired so deep in mud that the doors couldn't open and the crew had to exit through the windows. My 1089A1P2's have twin 30K winches and could have possibly done the job as well. "My" should be interpreted loosely, these trucks belong to the National Guard and can you believe they pay me to have this kind of fun!

Funny you say that. I was referring to winching and Pulling personally. My regular job is in the oil field. Everything out there has a 60,000 pound winch on it. I’m not so worried about straight line pull as I am rigging inspection. If one of those lines break it’s going to clear the deck.

Wire rope inspection is a big deal.


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[rustystud]

I was referring to winching and Pulling personally. My regular job is in I’m not so worried about straight line pull as I am rigging inspection. If one of those lines break it’s going to clear the deck.

Wire rope inspection is a big deal.


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You got that right ! I've personally seen a 5/8" cable let go and it was not funny ! I was winching out a 160 ft Western Red Cedar with my IHC TD18 when the line snapped. The shackle hit the cab like "Thor's Hammer" !!!!
I still remember my father running up to see if I was alright. I had ducked when I heard the crash (fat lot of good that would have done me though if it hadn't hit the cage) and my dad say me. He though I was hit. I actually never saw the line coming it was so fast. I only ducked when I heard it hit.
So yes line maintenance is paramount in winch safety.

 

[Floridianson]

Yes inspection of the outside cable is a good thing but if you have a solid core it is hard to inspect the inside. They make a grease injector rig for injecting grease into a cable but it can be a pain if there is a lot of cable. They got us one for the tug boat but I don't think we ever used it.

 

[rustystud]

Yes inspection of the outside cable is a good thing but if you have a solid core it is hard to inspect the inside. They make a grease injector rig for injecting grease into a cable but it can be a pain if there is a lot of cable. They got us one for the tug boat but I don't think we ever used it.

So you've been working on the tug's too ! Don't they use that synthetic rope now? I remember watching "How it's Made" and all the tugs seemed to be using that Purple synthetic rope.

 

[Floridianson]

The 230 foot fuel barge had a rope hawser and the Tug had steel cable. I was offshore towing late 1970's Louisiana. Its was funny first day on the job and I figured that when we let out maybe 400 feet of the cable it would pull tight and we would be towing. No the line has a big belly and almost seems like the tug pulls the belly and the belly pulls the barge. Ruff water you wanted a big belly in the cable. Good job, good food, great people.

 

[davidb56]

An electric winch will serve you well then. Remember to buy some "snatch blocks".

And a circuit breaker between the winch and batteries. I use my winch on my dodge cummins pulling firewood in the woods a lot. Im buying a Deuce now to replace the dodge and will add a 18-24K winch. I have snatch blocks, shackles and pull cables with extra crosby cable clamps. Remember to gets some good (from a rigging supply, not HF, in this case) 20k "basket" rated eyed straps to wrap around trees and set your block for either doubling up your pulling power, or angle pulling to keep you from going someplace you don't want to be.

 

[davidb56]

So you've been working on the tug's too ! Don't they use that synthetic rope now? I remember watching "How it's Made" and all the tugs seemed to be using that Purple synthetic rope.

my auger truck had synthetic, If I could find some cheap (like me) Id use it.

 

[davidb56]

The Sherpa Stallion has synthetic rope option. 1100$ is a very good price.

 

[MudMarine]

Yeah I think I'm definitely going electric winch and then hoping to never get stuck!

 

[davidb56]

when I was young (decades ago) you could pick up old WW2/Korean war landing panels real cheap. they were approx 2'x8', 14 guage steel with 1 1/2" holes punched through them with a little 1/8th inch lip to grip the soil. Id like to find about 4 of them for traction mats when I do something stupid. I bet they cost a bundle now if you could actually find some. Seabees would know what they were called.

 

[davidb56]

Marston Mat.....I wish I had a few of them for traction. And my dimensions were wrong....

 

[fasttruck]

he snatch block is your friend. The issue for a WW truck is one but I would carry more if I was going someplace where I expected to get stuck. A block can do 3 things but one at a time: develop mechanical advantage, change the direction of the pull or serve as a trolley block. The ratio of sheave size to the cable is 12:1. 1.5" cable = 6" block. If the sheave is appropriate for the cable then the hook and sideplates should match too. Pic of a 3:1 "Z" rig with 3/4" cable and 60 ton blocks attached.

 

[rustystud]

he snatch block is your friend. The issue for a WW truck is one but I would carry more if I was going someplace where I expected to get stuck. A block can do 3 things but one at a time: develop mechanical advantage, change the direction of the pull or serve as a trolley block. The ratio of sheave size to the cable is 12:1. 1.5" cable = 6" block. If the sheave is appropriate for the cable then the hook and sideplates should match too. Pic of a 3:1 "Z" rig with 3/4" cable and 60 ton blocks attached.View attachment 757632

Is that a M60 or M48 tank ? Looks like a M48 but it has been a while since I last saw one .
I like the way they used the snatch blocks here. Basically it is a "Quad" pull (doubled and then doubled again) with a third less line used. When I went through Tank school they taught us all kinds of rigging technics to basically "unstick" a Tank.
I still find it quite fascinating how a single line from a single winch can be configured to pull such tremendous loads by just using a few snatch blocks and anchor points.
Those ancient Greeks where pretty smart ! At least I think it was the ancient Greeks. Maybe they stole the idea from some other ancient race that got wiped out. At any rate it was some ancient man who came up with the original idea.