6.2 with turbo build in progress

[12vctd]

Well just show me dyno numbers, balance and blueprint the motor, I have built many gas motors as well. I look forward to your dyno numbers. As anyone who can pioneer things I respect. A few questions do you have a EGT gauge? I would like to see your EGT numbers with your dyno runs. As well as the flow meters that was used for the flows three times more air than stock? Sorry I go with results that are proven not just a seat of the pants or best guess. As I said im not trying to get in a pissing contest or anything like that, I will gladly support anything that has proof.

 

[wallew]

You are aware that Edison tried over 2000 filiments BEFORE he used tungsten that actually worked.

I have always used that as my motivation. I wish I DID have an egt. I have almost purchased one on two separate occasions. But you know what? It was always to prove something to someone else. YOU buy the egt and let me use it. Then I'll gladly provide as many numbers as I can. I don't mind doing the work. But as I've said many times.

I'm a cheap SOB.

And NO, no pissing contest. I WISH I COULD PROVIDE WHAT YOU ASKED. I just don't have the equipment. Hey, I only have a carport on our current abode (we've moved several times in the past thirty years and this house doesn't have a garage - others we have bought or rented have). It's a pain when the weather goes cold like now. All the more reason I'm amenable to 101coolcars doing the dyno runs AND letting them install the tips.

You and I know that it will take longer to describe HOW to do it than to actually do it. I am going to be taking over 200 pix for the article. And I will have the dyno run slips.

Then on to a TH400 rebuild. THEN my spare 6.2 rebuild commences. Man am I glad I'm retired. I'm busier now than when I worked two full time jobs.

I will post what I come up with. And if it's correct? YOU GUYS WILL BE THE SECOND ONES TO KNOW.

101coolcars and I will be the first ones.

 

[12vctd]

Lol I cant buy a EGT gauge for myself let alone anyone else. I simply tell people be careful when adding any fuel mod to a NA diesel engine things can get hot fast. Id hate to see anyone ruin thier motor. There are alot of tricks one can do 2 a 6.2 theres increased fueling by modding your injectors and injection pump, advancing the timing, turbos, lowering compression, balancing the motor, basically anything that will reduce drag, increase air, help with exhausting this air, and then adding fuel for your increased air will help produce more power. If had a surplus of money which trust me I do not I would show people what a 6.2 can produce before it simply becomes a scrap heap. Problem for me is also that these motors are not sturdy enough to handle large increases in power. So I try to recomend safe reliable power increases. For me the money needed to increase the power of a 6.2 to say 350 rwhp is to great and can be done easier and cheaper IMO with a repower. I love the 6.2 first and foremost as its a diesel and I will take a diesel over a gas engine any day, secondly because they are plentiful cheap and great motors when taken care of they give great life and fuel economy. A helping hand in the power dept is nice as long as its not going to cause premature engine failure. But again I di not mean to hijack Bubbas thread and I cant wait to see his motor done. As well as see your improvements Waller

 

[nattieleather]

Ok Bubba let's talk about you... That's some nice machining work you did on the girdle. Is that aluminum or steel? I'm learning a lot on this thread. I'm glad to know that one can basically turn up a 6.2 by adding a 6.5 IP, 6.5 injectors and the turbo off a 6.5. Good stuff to know. Keep us posted Bubba with more pics and more discriptions of your rebuild/tune up of this motor!

 

[bubba_got_you]

they are steel. i will get it all plugged up today i hope and then all i have to do it acquire the turbo and other things i need then i will really start the work lol

 

[WARWAG]

I love that 6.2 Girdle Bubba! Im not sure what material you made her out of. Looks like aluminum but again its a picture. Love what your doing!

As for the Dyno test the other guy (Wallew) is doing. I think your a good man to put your money where your mouth is! No matter what the Dyno reveals I say thanks! This can only help us all when we see what the numbers are. Glad to see your a stand up man and volunteered to do this. Thanks.

 

[BIG_RED]

Bubba - can you tell me your thoughts on the main bearing girdle? I've heard mixed reviews from all kinds of folks all claiming either "they make a huge difference" or "waste of money". Some even told me they were detrimental because the girdle reduces the amount of threads that the bolts can reach. I have alot of experience with engines. I work at an engine shop. I remember girdles like that used on some ford motors, but I believe that was to solve a different problem (I'm the Chevy guy, I don't know much about the fords) What do you think? majorly helpful? Help prevent main webs breaking? I've been told saving main webs on a 6.2 is hopeless, that it's only a matter of time. I'd rather my engine doesn't blow up while I'm in the middle of nowhere. Reliability is my main concern.

Also, harmonic balancers.. The one on my 6.2 seems ok. It's solid, no rips in the rubber, and the engine runs quite smooth for an old diesel. But it's 24 years old. I think I want to replace it. Which is best? Fluidamper are supposed to be good, but I heard they don't work in cold climates. (full of liquid, that gets thick and un-balances in the cold) SuperDamper's cost like $500 and they work the same way as a stock one. Don't think it'd be worth it. There are also Rattler Dampers that work with little metal weights, Those sound cool, but cost $$$. What would you suggest using? I've always just used OEM dampers, but on most engines I've worked on they're not that big of a deal. I heard that a 6.2 will bust a crank if it has a bad damper. Busted crank on my 6.2 means my truck is getting a Chevy Small Block. I'd prefer a gm diesel but I don't like worrying about a busted crank all the time. And Cummins isn't in the budget for now.

I am good at listening - give me some education

 

[rickf]

I have read this thread from end to end and I only saw one question about compression and it was not answered. One thing you NEED to be aware of is that the 6.2 has 23:1 compression and the 6.5 has 18:1. If you put a 6.5 turbo on there your effective ratio is going to jump up close to 30:1! You will never keep head gaskets on it. As long as you do not load it down and if you back up the timing just a hair you will get by. If you put a load to it then...............
To address the other issue that people are saying the 6.2 pump will not flow enough for 6.5 injectors, well all you have to do is turn up the pump about 1/6 of a turn. I have seen at least a dozen of these engines that broke the crankshaft right behind the #2 rod. Be careful how much boost you put to it.


Rick

 

[Chief_919]

I have read this thread from end to end and I only saw one question about compression and it was not answered. One thing you NEED to be aware of is that the 6.2 has 23:1 compression and the 6.5 has 18:1. If you put a 6.5 turbo on there your effective ratio is going to jump up close to 30:1! You will never keep head gaskets on it. As long as you do not load it down and if you back up the timing just a hair you will get by. If you put a load to it then...............
To address the other issue that people are saying the 6.2 pump will not flow enough for 6.5 injectors, well all you have to do is turn up the pump about 1/6 of a turn. I have seen at least a dozen of these engines that broke the crankshaft right behind the #2 rod. Be careful how much boost you put to it.


Rick

Not sure where your numbers are coming from, but the 6.2 CR is 21.5:1, and the 6.5 was either 21.3:1, 20.3:1 or 20.2:1.

The only ones that left the factory at 18:1 were special built marine grade engine from GEP, and the odds of finding one of those is rare indeed.

You will find most broken cranks have a bad harmonic balancer attached- if the balencer fails, the crank goes shortly after.

 

[rickf]

My numbers came from the machining specs for the motors straight from GM. Many years ago I doubted the figures so I puffed one and they were accurate. The 6.5 numbers came from gm tech sheets that I should still have around. I will see if I can find them but it will not be this weekend as I have a major house repair to do.

I have been known to be wrong but like I said I verified the 6.2 figure.

Rick

 

[Chief_919]

My numbers came from the machining specs for the motors straight from GM. Many years ago I doubted the figures so I puffed one and they were accurate. The 6.5 numbers came from gm tech sheets that I should still have around. I will see if I can find them but it will not be this weekend as I have a major house repair to do.

I have been known to be wrong but like I said I verified the 6.2 figure.

Rick

If you ahve acces to them and can scan them, I would love to see them. I am kind of a 6.2/6.5 nut.

The only specs I have seen for 18:1 are for the engines purpose built for marine applications.

The website for GEP, who makes the 6.5 now, list it as 20.2:1 and 18:1 only for marine applications.

Engine Specifications | General Engine Products | AM General LLC - Mobility solutions for the 21st Century

 

[wallew]

Chief,
SEE, the MARINE application was different.

I CAN'T THANK YOU ENOUGH. You give me encouragement to continue in search of low cost power.

Now, I will say one thing about ANY bump in HP.

YOUR MPG will drop like a stone. Especially if you just can't resist twisting the tail as it were. I HAVE AN EXTREMELY HEAVY RIGHT FOOT. I think it's called 'leadfootitis' but I could be incorrect.

I'm pretty sure that IF I can bump my HP up my mpg WILL SUFFER.

I cannot resist to tromp the pedal as I 'merge' on the highway and I love the occasional surprised look as I blow past some slow poke doing minimum speed limit.

I'm always running at the ragged edge of legal. LEGAL I STAY. But I do push it right up to the wall.

 

[Chief_919]

Chief,
SEE, the MARINE application was different.

I CAN'T THANK YOU ENOUGH. You give me encouragement to continue in search of low cost power.

Yes, the lower CR in the marine engines is due to the fact that they run more boost in them, often the marine applications are supercharged instead of turbocharged.

More boost means more air, so you can burn more fuel, making more power.

In addition marine applications can push more fuel because marine cooling systems are water/water instead of air/water, so they cool much better. If you took a good running, tuned for max power marine engine out and put the same engine in a truck it would overheat.

Marine injectors alone won't flow any more fuel, and won't make much more, if any, power.

If you put a marine IP and injectors in an NA engine, you will be flowing too much fuel and burn a piston quite quickly.

There just isn't any way to get around it. You can't put the fuel system from a marine application on without also adding the forced induction system to move the air.

I hate to say it, but you just won't find skads of cheap power for the 6.2. To make more power, you need to burn more fuel. To burn more fuel, you need more air. That means you need a turbocharger or supercharger.

 

[wallew]

OK, all you diesel mechanics.

IF the MARINE built 6.2L was built at 18:1 instead of 20/21:1 when I do my build could I rebuild it to the LOWER compression ratio specs?

Not sure of the ramifications either.

Not trying to flame anyone, just trying to find my way through the diesel jungle...

 

[12vctd]

lets quit jacking bubba's thread and jack my new thread.

 

[Chief_919]

OK, all you diesel mechanics.

IF the MARINE built 6.2L was built at 18:1 instead of 20/21:1 when I do my build could I rebuild it to the LOWER compression ratio specs?

Not sure of the ramifications either.

Not trying to flame anyone, just trying to find my way through the diesel jungle...

Indeed, you can rebuild yours for 18:1 and then you will be able to run higher levels of boost from your turbo system.

The guys pushing for max power from 6.2/6.5 engines do just that.

But you will need a turbo engineered to deliver enough boost to make it worth it. Just dropping the CR alone won't do it, a lower CR is only good if you are doing it to run more boost.

This website:

The Diesel Page - for the 6.2L, 6.5L, and Duramax 6600 (6.6L) GM Chevrolet and GMC diesel engines.

Is full of guys who have done that.

 

[WARWAG]

BUBBA
Where will you be getting your 6.5 Turbo from?

 

[dstang97]

lets quit jacking bubba's thread and jack my new thread.

Where is it?

 

[dstang97]

Chief,
SEE, the MARINE application was different.

I CAN'T THANK YOU ENOUGH. You give me encouragement to continue in search of low cost power.

Now, I will say one thing about ANY bump in HP.

YOUR MPG will drop like a stone. Especially if you just can't resist twisting the tail as it were. I HAVE AN EXTREMELY HEAVY RIGHT FOOT. I think it's called 'leadfootitis' but I could be incorrect.

I'm pretty sure that IF I can bump my HP up my mpg WILL SUFFER.

I cannot resist to tromp the pedal as I 'merge' on the highway and I love the occasional surprised look as I blow past some slow poke doing minimum speed limit.

I'm always running at the ragged edge of legal. LEGAL I STAY. But I do push it right up to the wall.

If your looking for cheap horsepower why not advance the pump and turn up your pump? As far as I know the only difference between a marine injector and stock is a higher pop rating and that will give you a crappy idle. May be ok for a M1008 screaming down the highway though.

 

[bubba_got_you]

I really don’t know what to think about the girdle. I decided to do it because I figured “it can’t hurt” I am using longer bolts to makeup for the loss of thread so no problems there. So we will see.
As for the dampener I am going with the stock dampener as I am not going nuts with this motor and I baby my motors so I figure it will be fine.
As for compression and popping heads, this mod has been done for years and I don’t know of anyone who doesn’t abuse there motor that has a problem.
Obviously if you abuse and over-rev your motor things will brake.
It is a fact of life.
I have friends who are always abusing there car and are always replacing parts and then they ask me what is wrong with there motor. My answer to them is always the same “its not the motor”.
I have faith in this conversion as it has been done many times with good results.
[FONT=&quot]ALSO the girdle is steel I just threw it in the sand blaster before I started working with that is why it looks like aluminum. [/FONT]