CARC paint;how to remove-yet another question...

[bigmike]

Buck when I did my goar it took way to loog and the cost kep going up. You can see osic here if look. This spring I will be duing this spring on one of my M35s .
John

Translation please!!!

 

[bullfrog1234]

if you are not in any hurry, use a heat gun. It is cheaper, just takes time. I have done my M35 and I will admit it taken some time, but my wallet did not hurt. On the places I could not get a blade into, I circled it with chalk, which I came back later with a sand blaster to finish up. There are several heat guns out there. I got two of the HF ones for 10.00 and they did the job. I am about to start on my second M35. Again, time. The chemical remover I would not use. They cost a lot

 

[MWMULES]

I went a got the needle scalier from Harbor freight and it cuts through the Carc like butter. I did the outside of the rear cross member of my M818 in less than 5mins. Last week I needed to check my serial # on the frame and used aircraft stripper, took 3 applications of stripper plus a razor scrapper and over 30 mins just to clean off 2X10" section to read the numbers. I used aircraft stripper on the dash and it worked a lot faster as the Carc was thinner, just make sure you don't get it on the indicator lights or gauge faces as it will melt plastic.

 

[NMC_EXP]

If you can find an outfit that does "dry ice" blasting give them a try.

Link to Cryoblast:

http://www.cryo-blast.com/

I've seen a couple of demos of this system where I worked. Same principle as sand blasting but they use rice grain sized pellets of dry ice.

This was developed to strip paint from the aluminum skin of aircraft.

They used it on a steel workbench that had several coats of oil based enamel on it. He was removing one layer at a time without damaging the paint underneath.

The only residue to clean up is the paint dust. The dry ice just evaporates. Plus you do not end up with sand and grit inside all those moving parts.

Regards

Jim

 

[Dodge man]

PRC DeSoto makes a chemical stripper called PR-3500 which contains phenol which will blister the skin in short order, plus it has a very distinctive smell.

When I have large surfaces requiring cured polyurethanes to be removed, I coat the surface with two coats of PR-3500 and then cover the wetted surface with newspaper to keep the evaporation to a minimum. After about an hour, I strip back the paper to reveal a heavily wrinkled painted surface.

Coating with aluminium foil might work better. (Check first, it may react with the stripper!) Foil will seal the surface completely and won't absorb any of the stripper. Heating the surface before applying the stripper may make it work better too.

I use a similar technique to get labels off of surplus equipment. Heat the surface thoroughly, apply Goo-Gone and then cover with aluminium foil. Normally GG evaporates too quickly but covering it with foil allows it to work longer before evaporating.

PS, Amway sells (or did sell?) aluminium foil in BIG rolls. Their price was a little higher than the grocery stores but their rolls had about 15X more foil!

 

[greg6459]

Soda blasting with baking soda...

 

[wdbtchr]

Here's a different one, my DTC 8606 forklift has CARC paint on it just looks like normal camo. There is a stencil on the right front fender that states:
WDCARC
01/05
I was told that meant it was painted with the water based CARC in January of 05. Last winter it started popping paint in quarter sized spots all over the forktruck down to bare metal. The strange thing is the backside of the chips were white. I figured the paint would come off easily with the needle scaler, but it doesn't. Go figure, I have an Ingersol Rand long stroke scaler that is designed for welding slag. Got me beat I'm just going to spot prime it until I figure out what's going on.

 

[Nonotagain]

Here's a different one, my DTC 8606 forklift has CARC paint on it just looks like normal camo. There is a stencil on the right front fender that states:

WDCARC
01/05
I was told that meant it was painted with the water based CARC in January of 05. Last winter it started popping paint in quarter sized spots all over the forktruck down to bare metal. The strange thing is the backside of the chips were white. I figured the paint would come off easily with the needle scaler, but it doesn't. Go figure, I have an Ingersol Rand long stroke scaler that is designed for welding slag. Got me beat I'm just going to spot prime it until I figure out what's going on.

The white primer is a waterborne lead and chromate free primer. The specification is Mil-Prf-53022. BTW, it's junk.

My company extensively tested the lead and chromate free primer with the first version of the Mil-Dtl-64159 water dispersible CARC and found that if you did not apply the CARC to at least 4 mils thick that if failed adhesion testing.

I imagine that the localized areas of paint popping if closely inspected will show that the CARC was either damaged in that area or that the CARC coating was thin in those areas.

Since you area talking about a fork truck, you could throw some 80 grit sand paper on a DA sander and feather the popped areas out, then spot prime.

The usual PPE precautions, no eating, smoking, or drinking until cleaned up as well as use a good fitting dust mask and safety glasses. Keep the kids out of the area and dispose of any sanding fines in an approved fashion. Wash all clothing separate from other household items.

 

[jimmcld]

The needle scaler worked on my wrecker. A lot faster than sanding and a lot less dust.

 

[randini]

You can try a "sand-injector" with a power washer. I have cleaned greasy car frames with this, and it worked great. It is a down stream device that picks up sand and combines it with the pressurized water in its own mixing wand. Google it.

 

[m16ty]

I've removed a bunch of CARC and I haven't found a "easy" way yet.

Seems CARC has some characteristics where it will fall off in sheets in some spots and then hold on for dear life in others. Makes for a heck of a time trying to make a smooth paint job unless you take it all off.

 

[Blood_of_Tyrants]

36 grit sanding discs on a 4" grinder will last about the area of a door.

 

[srodocker]

sears has a 50lb sand blaster kit for 60$...includes the hopper and nossel...should i go this route in removing my paint or go with the needle scalers?

 

[clinto]

The white primer is a waterborne lead and chromate free primer. The specification is Mil-Prf-53022. BTW, it's junk.

My company extensively tested the lead and chromate free primer with the first version of the Mil-Dtl-64159 water dispersible CARC and found that if you did not apply the CARC to at least 4 mils thick that if failed adhesion testing.

I imagine that the localized areas of paint popping if closely inspected will show that the CARC was either damaged in that area or that the CARC coating was thin in those areas.

I meant to ask you this at some point in the past and now is as good a time as any. I have access to a very high quality epoxy primer (we have used on multiple classic car restorations with very high end paint jobs and have been very pleased with it) at a reduced price (my friend is a distributor). This is it:

http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/Product lines.htm

Tech sheet: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/tech sheets new/2010revised/Expoxy_primer.pdf

MSDS: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/MSDS Sheets/msds09/6600_6610_6620_6700_MSDS_Final.pdf

I'd much rather use this stuff, as we've had such good luck with it (we've had 2 trailers that were stripped and primed with this stuff 3 years ago, then the business fell apart and they were never finished and they've been in the elements ever since without a bit of fade, corrosion, etc.). But I don't want to spend the money to buy 5 gallons of CARC and shoot my truck with it only to find they are incompatible.

Opinions?

 

[JCKnife]

36 grit sanding discs on a 4" grinder will last about the area of a door.

Yep, if you're working on flat areas. Corners and edges will eat up those pads much quicker (like bumper and grill work that I'm doing now).

 

[Nonotagain]

I meant to ask you this at some point in the past and now is as good a time as any. I have access to a very high quality epoxy primer (we have used on multiple classic car restorations with very high end paint jobs and have been very pleased with it) at a reduced price (my friend is a distributor). This is it:

http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/Product lines.htm

Tech sheet: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/tech sheets new/2010revised/Expoxy_primer.pdf

MSDS: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com/MSDS Sheets/msds09/6600_6610_6620_6700_MSDS_Final.pdf

I'd much rather use this stuff, as we've had such good luck with it (we've had 2 trailers that were stripped and primed with this stuff 3 years ago, then the business fell apart and they were never finished and they've been in the elements ever since without a bit of fade, corrosion, etc.). But I don't want to spend the money to buy 5 gallons of CARC and shoot my truck with it only to find they are incompatible.

Opinions?

Clinto,

The folks from Southern Polyurethanes are very vague on the solids constituents in the primer. There are no corrosion inhibitors or filler products listed, only the solvent blend that they use. With all of the solvents listed, this stuff is over 1450 grams per liter in VOC's. That's insanely high. If nothing else, it should do one heck of a job at cleaning the surface.

From the description of the primer, its intended purpose is an epoxy sealer, not for corrosion inhibition.

Do you have access to any zinc based epoxies? That would be the ticket to a long lasting paint job on one of these trucks. (that and good surface preparation).

If you can get a couple of panels shot with this primer, I can shoot some CARC on them and perform paint adhesion testing using a method called PATTI testing per ASTM-D-4541. I use this equipment weekly on production parts to verify the adhesion of the applied coatings systems.

 

[thehaas]

wear mask get 40 grit grinder around 5 inch disk grind down light moving grinder to keep heat down then orbital sander with 80 grit can due hood fenders doors cab in 2 days non flat panels sand blast or paint remover did whole truck two years ago metal is thicker so you can get away with lot more than car

 

[papakb]

OK gentlemen,

I've read all the postings and it seems like everyone is stripping CARC off of steel. What do you do for an aluminum HMMWV? AM General's quality control obviously didn't make it down the hallway to the paint department. There's not an ounce of primer on the body. Where the CARC is flaking off it goes directly to anodized aluminum. In other places it's like part of the metal. Go figure.

Sanding, abrasive blasting, or needle guns are out because they'll remove the anodizing and leave the aluminum suceptible to oxidation. Has anyone done large areas with either of the strippers mentiioned?

My truck has an ambulance body on it and expansion and contraction have cause some of the body rivets on top to loosen up and weep in wet weather. What I want to do is to strip the entire top and then use Line X or Herculiner on it to seal it again. Since it's paintable I can make it green again fairly easily.

Thanks

 

[Nonotagain]

The PR-3500 stripper that I mentioned is safe for use on aluminum and will not harm the anodized aluminum.

You will have to use some type of conversion coating prior to the application of paint unless you use an acid based wash primer prior to the specified epoxy primer.

AM General will have used a primer on your truck, but it's probably white to slightly tan in color which can make it difficult to see if the truck was painted with tan CARC.

Painting aluminum is easy, painting aluminum correctly is difficult.

Due to the flexing of the body panels, correct thicknesses are critical. Primers should be applied thin (usually .0006-.0012" thick) and the CARC topcoat should be around .002-.004" thick.

 

[Unforgiven]

According to this:

III

the military didn't start using CARC paint until 1974.

Is it safe to assume, then, that any pre-74 vehicles are NOT painted in CARC?