Deuce won't idle after IP swap

[lawdog1623]

im gonna say it wasnt timed properly!

 

[gimpyrobb]

I'm gonna say you are wrong.

 

[Maxwell1815]

well, I found my phone under the deuce...in 2 pieces, so, until i get a new one, I have to continue with this post...

I triple checked timing, and I have fuel spraying out of each injector...
the injector sprays exactly at the same moment that cylinder is on the compression stroke. I crank and crank and crank...and nothing more than puffs of smoke out of the exhaust, but it won't fire..not even a sputter...

And again!! cyl 1 is at TDC with both valves closed...with the timing pointer aligned with the scribed mark on the IP drive gear in the little window. My FDC is bypassed, and...i think that is it. I was surprised at how little fuel sprayed out of the injector...I expected a greater volume...maybe my pump isn't pumping enough? All new fuel filters, (three of them)

 

[gimpyrobb]

I have often had to use starting fluid to get a truck to fire after taking the IP apart. Since you are using a "used" IP, I would dump a bunch of "sea foam" brand fuel cleaner into the filter housings and try to drive it a bit. They really don't inject THAT much fluid into the cyl to have the motor run. I doubt its a volume issue, but you should be able to measure it if you like. In the LDS trouble shooting guide, it has a table for fuel consumption. You might see if your close, but I bet it is a waste of time.

 

[Broke Down]

Are the injectors misting or have kind of a drip to them? If you don't have good flow and pressure you won't be able to fire it. I'm with gimpy, hit it with some ether and see what it does.

 

[Maxwell1815]

the injectors mist pretty good. I will ether it tomorrow and see what she does! Thanks Gimpy and broke down.

 

[Maxwell1815]

ok, So i can get it started on ether, and keep it running with the accelerator pedal, but it still will not idle, nor will it start back up without ether...

 

[gimpyrobb]

How far out is the fuel rod?

I am talking about the screw that has 2 nuts on it - that you turn to increase the fuel delivery.

 

[gimpyrobb]

See post #2 for pic.

http://www.steelsoldiers.com/deuce/53010-how-turn-up-fuel-pictures.html

 

[Maxwell1815]

I will look in the a.m. thanks for the info! The only thing is, that this pump worked great 2 years ago in the other engine (before it threw a rod)

 

[Broke Down]

I am very interested in seeing what the issue and fix is.

 

[G-Force]

Have you ever heard this engine run before???
You stated you finally got the engine back in....why was it out???

 

[Broke Down]

He swapped the ip from a burnt up engine to his current engine.

 

[G-Force]

But the question I ask is did this engine run before he did this???
Why did he replace the pump????
Has he ever heard this engine run and how did it run????

 

[Maxwell1815]

I swapped the engine because the old one threw a rod see the thread "Major Meltdown"
the new engine did not run because the fuel shutoff lever was frozen, so i put the pump back on from the blown motor. yes, this new motor does run, i had it running with this current pump, but when i fixed the timing, it will not start without ether. it will run after started, but it wont idle...must be kept running with the accelerator pedal. and it won't restart without ether. but the motor sounds good when running. Seems strong. But just wont stay running

 

[Floridianson]

sent you my number PM

 

[G-Force]

Maxwell,
I was just wondering if you had heard the engine run and if not it could be anoter problem and not your IP.
I would start over again with the timing....it sounds like timing to me.

 

[m-35tom]

When you installed the IP, did you check any other timing indicators other than the crankshaft pulley?
You could have checked the scored disk under the little 4 bolt window or that the motor was TDC by pulling the front valve cover and seeing if the #1 cul valves were closed.

Just so we are on the same-page, you set the motor's crank to its LDT indicator and then pulled the original pump. Then you just bolted on the "üsed"pump? I am only asking so I know what all was done to install the 2nd pump.

but the 'or' is incorrect, there are 3 'ands' that must be followed to assure correct timing.

 

[m-35tom]

The red scored tooth of the hydraulic head has nothing to do with timing the IP to the motor. Please don't bring that into the equation.
As long as the crank pulley is at the LDT mark(this IS a turbo motor, right?) is lined up, and the motor is at TDC(verified by the #1 cyl valves being closed). you should install the IP with the scored mark lined up with the pointer.



You know if you loosen the 3 outer bolts on the drive gear(of the IP), you can line up the scored mark with the pointer, with out turning the motor, right?

sorry chris, but it does have a LOT to do with installation, just NOT timing.

that is because the IP shaft turns at crank speed while the HH turns at cam speed.

so what you have is what someone said earlier.

1: crank on correct timing mark AND #1 valves closed so we know it was on compression stroke.

AND then

2: timing mark under little cover lined up AND red tooth visable from shut off cover opening. (now it just so happens that the red tooth is 1 tooth to the rear of the HH removal mark which has nothing to do with timing, it is just a removal point indicator.)

note: #2 is because the ip timing mark will come up again, but at the wrong timing point i.e. 180 out and it may run, but real bad and no power.

tom

 

[sandcobra164]

I'm not trying to add to the confusion but now I'm confused. I did a HH O ring job on a Deuce for a member on here. When the red scored tooth for the HH installation was lined up in the fuel shut off area on the ip, the red line in the 4 bolted window was off to the side. Visible but not lined up with the mark. The motor did not turn from the time we took it apart. The truck ran fine after and was later sold. Please educate. Gimpy walked me through the process over the phone when I hit a brick wall. He sounded like he had one of these apart in front of him, pretty spot on. I'm interested to see how this comes together and I'm sure I'll learn something.