M1007 - CUCV Suburban Clone Build Thread

gimpyrobb

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Watch the double-digit boost Tim. The 6.5 heads pop headgaskets at 15ish psi. Not sure on a turboed 6.2.
 

srs78

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Sweet! A beautiful ride.

How does the plate cover the winch, hard to tell, does it swing down?

Or do you physicall have to remove it for winch access?
Thanks for your compliments. I try to make do from whatever I have available and accessible. I’m thankful that I was able to source out the proper CUCV bits to make this “ m1007” project happen. My base vehicle however is a gasser with the 350 cid engine. It was a former armored embassy escort vehicle with the heavy duty suspension and positrac. I lightened it by removing all armor stuff which was quite heavy. I have the hideaway flip plate holder mounted on the fairlead and flip swings down. I have momentarily removed it preferring the exposed fairlead winch look. If you're interested they are available in Ebay.
 

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Barrman

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Chris, no worries on too much boost. It is neat to actually get above 10 psi. Just to know it can. I imagine the times it gets that high will be few and far between. I purposely left the GEP NA 6500 bottom end alone and kept the 22.5:1 compression pistons. I wanted as much non turbo umph as possible. Mainly because I actually like the way NA 6.2 vehicles drive below 45 mph. Plain and simple, no fuss and all mechanical with no magic involved.

The turbo is for above 45 mph steady cruising down the highway. Which is why I went to all the effort to get the 60° intake bolt GEP center mount turbo heads with the diamond precups to work with a 6.2 NA intake manifold. I figured it would be a best of both worlds thing. Low end NA grunt, ok fuel mpg and the turbo to make the highway nice even if there were hills or headwinds. Which is exactly what I had. Now, with the leak fixed the turbo is reaching down to about 5 mph and begging me to use it. It is a very suggestive beg too. Very hard to ignore but I am working on it.


As far as the lock out hubs. You can use the -30p technical manual to find the exact GM parts number for a m1009 and search that way. Or, just plug in 1985 K5 blazer to just about any parts store website and get the same result.
 

Recovry4x4

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May ask what are the correct lock hub for my truck. Should they be for a Dana44? Any recommendations please? Mile Marker ? Warn?
I can't link to a large auction site but if you looked there (US of course) you would find them. They are nothing more than a pair of Warn standard hubs but they are blacked out. If I had a set, I'd send them your way. A few years back a bunch of new or rebuilt front axles were auctioned off. You could buy them new in the crate for $400. Folks got smart and started parting them out. I'd bet CUCVRUS has/had a good stash of new in the crate axle assys.
 

srs78

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I can't link to a large auction site but if you looked there (US of course) you would find them. They are nothing more than a pair of Warn standard hubs but they are blacked out. If I had a set, I'd send them your way. A few years back a bunch of new or rebuilt front axles were auctioned off. You could buy them new in the crate for $400. Folks got smart and started parting them out. I'd bet CUCVRUS has/had a good stash of new in the crate axle assys.
Thank you for the heads-up.🍻
 

Warthog

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Congrats on Colton. He has made you guys proud. I have a 1982 GL1100 sitting under a tarp. Roadtrip?
 

Skinny

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Looking good!

I just finished getting my CUCV bumpers on. Working on rear tire and generator carrier for the Dante's Peak CUCV.

How did you mount your rear setup? I ended up flipping my frame brackets over and adding some holes so they fit with my tow bar. Im curious to see how you have your pintle mounted as my brackets are going to need serious rework to fit.


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Skinny

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No one makes a snorkel for this truck. Everyone uses a Toyota FJ80 I think which fits pretty close and can be had for around $100 if you buy a knock off and not a genuine ARB.

You will have to mock it up since the template doesn't fit. Then take a heat gun to the base and pull the upper pievce towards the windshield.

Not a hard job jist commitment to cutting a huge hole in your fender. Then obviously making the connection to your air cleaner.

I used a battery box from Jegs. Then was able to connect to the throttle body and utilizing a very common large filter. Big block 8.1 has a lot of breathing to do

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Barrman

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Post #169 in this thread shows my pictures of the rear M1008 bumper and brackets before they got installed. I ended up cutting the frame some and moving the brackets on the bumper just a little bit. Except, I welded one of them back on the bumper about 1/4" too high. So, now I have to live with a bumper that looks a little crooked and low on the drivers side. 1/4" in the middle sure makes for a good bit at the end of the bumper.
 

Skinny

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Awesome

Thanks for the pics. I am not sure that I am going to try to sneak those pencil brackets in until I actually have a use for it.

Yeah fixing that problem isn't exactly easy when the bumper bracket is 1/2" plate.

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Barrman

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Exactly, that is why I have just left it.

I topped the Cowdog off with fuel this morning on my way to work. Tomorrow I will load it with gear and youth. 15 of us are going to drive all day and about 600 miles to Guadalupe Mountains National Park. We plan to summit the highest peak in Texas Sunday and then drive back Monday. Should be about 1200 miles for the weekend. This is exactly what I built the truck for and I am very excited about getting to use it for its intended purpose. It will also give me my first top off with fuel, drive at a steady speed for 300 miles and top off again fuel run. I will be leading a convoy of vehicles with 80 mph speed limits and long, long up hill grades though. That is a bit faster than I anticipated running by myself so mileage will probably be kind of low at those speeds. We will see.
 

Skinny

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That is a full day for the Burb. Loaded up and a fast pace. Those are the times you do not want a temp dummy light or a factory inaccurate gauge 🤣

Hopefully you don't have to lead...just duck behind the other large vehicle in the pack.

Did some more fab work on my tire carrier. The left side will be for the DC generator. Right side for the tire and a gas can. Got the inverter mounted up.


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Barrman

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So I logged 1225 miles in 3 days. Running 76 mph for a few hundred miles got me 16 to 17 mpg. 82 mph for 317 miles and 3000 feet of elevation gain got me 13.6.

82 mph had a steady 2-3 psi of boost on flat ground with 650° to 800° egt. Which was all well and good until long grades came along. I never had the boost over 10 psi. But the egt became a problem. I always shut it down when I passed over 1050°. I was able to maintain 70 of better on I-10.

However, off the interstate with steeper grades things changed. Going up to Guadalupe pass from 3000 feet to 5700 feet in just a few miles had me driving by egt gauge. I just kept it at 900° and didn’t worry about speed. I was down to 40 mph at one point. I made it, but was kind of concerned.

We camped across the New Mexico line 18 miles south of Carlsbad. Camp elevation was 3600 feet. We went to leave camp at 0100 Sunday and the truck didn’t want to start. 34° air temp. Glow plugs came on and voltage dropped with them. But it just cranked and cranked before finally starting after at least 10 seconds of spinning.

We went back up the pass from the less extreme side and made it to the top of Guadalupe Peak before sunrise. Which was well worth the effort of a very grueling climb of over 4 hours. Once back to the truck with temps above 70 outside. The truck didn’t want to start again. Now I was worried about too high egt and not starting.

I checked it out once back at camp and all seemed well. Another long crank start followed the next morning when we fired up to head home. I didn’t understand what was going on. But I had 10 hours of driving to think about it.

My conclusion was that without an intercooler. I was just asking too much of the engine. I also decided to look into alcohol injection as an alternative to an intercooler I really don’t have room to mount anywhere. Anyone have experience with either on these engines?

This morning at 428 feet above sea level and 63°. The truck fired up right away like normal. Maybe it doesn’t like thin air. Or is that normal?

I used about 1/8 of an inch of dipstick worth of oil on the trip. Everything else was great as well. Still a few things to improve, but the truck did real, real good.
 

Another Ahab

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However, off the interstate with steeper grades things changed. Going up to Guadalupe pass from 3000 feet to 5700 feet in just a few miles had me driving by egt gauge. I just kept it at 900° and didn’t worry about speed. I was down to 40 mph at one point. I made it, but was kind of concerned.

Maybe it doesn’t like thin air. Or is that normal?
5,700 feet above sea level is some right fine altitude.

I'm no engineer but you figure that has GOT to play into the performance.

I mean the athletes in Mexico City for those Olympics (5,000 foot plus, right?), they took two weeks of acclimation for the Gamers there to get up to speed (so to speak).

Sounds like a fun trip. Any pics?!
 

Barrman

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2 weeks of research has taught me some things I didn't know before.

I have a 1985-1993 Delco glow plug controller on the truck. This is the one that is gray in color, has 4 leads and doesn't go into the cooling system. GM went to the black 3 pin controller when they went to the computer controlled DS4 IP around 1994. I have seen black and gray controllers and never thought about them being different. Now I know. Use the gray one for non computer trucks.

I have the self limiting 60G glow plugs in the engine. Actually, I have them in all of my diesel engines. I like the security blanket of non swelling or exploding glow plugs. However, the gray 4 pin controller wasn't designed for them. It was designed for the 9G, 11G and 13G glow plugs. They are not self limiting and hit their 1400° temperature almost immediately. The 60G plugs take a few seconds to hit that temperature.

So, the normal 4 pin gray controller glow time of 8-10 seconds just isn't enough time to get full use of the 60G glow plugs. I have the same controller on my M715. I have always turned it on, let it glow, turn the system off and then back on real quick for fast starts. It just works better every time. However, the used 4 pin gray controller on the Cowdog wouldn't let me do that. It would do a glow cycle and if I turned off the ignition. It wouldn't come back on again. It was defective. I swapped in a new one last week. Double cycle down to 29° and the truck starts within a second of trying every time. That problem was identified, diagnosed and kind of solved.

I could make it work I felt at altitude again. But, what if I forgot or someone else was needed to drive? I need to make it idiot proof. An internet search for 6.2 and 6.5 glow plug cycle time too short brought all kinds of hits. I had never searched for that before. It seems a 5 Ohm 2 Watt resistor in the wire for terminal C will make every glow period 12-16 seconds and nothing else is needed. I hope to do that in the next week or so when I have time and will report what I find.

Starting is solved. EGT issues were also researched. Lowering the temperature of the air going into the engine will improve combustion efficiency and reduce exhaust gas temperatures. It can be looked at two ways. More power made with less fuel means less throttle to do the same thing as before and therefore, less heat. Or, the same amount of heat at the exhaust means the engine is putting out more power and speed is therefore increased. Neither comparison can be graphed on a straight line. I am just giving some basic generalizations.

Stuffing more air into an engine makes the engine more efficient. A gear or belt driven pump is called a super charger and an exhaust driven pump is called a turbo charger today. Both have been around for more than 100 years. The road up Pikes Peak was used to perfect them actually. Here is a great story about charge air induction:

https://www.airspacemag.com/history-of-flight/hill-climb-2023375/

Many WWII planes had both super chargers and turbo superchargers. Like any air compressor, which is basically all they are, they heat the air. Hot air takes up more space inside an engine and is less efficient than cool air. So, air plane designers put an air to air cooler between the super chargers and turbo chargers. They called it an intercooler because it was between the two charging devices. Some even had an air to air cooler after the last compressor called an after cooler. After the war many of these planes could be bought for less than the value of the fuel inside their tanks. Many and in some cases. All of some models were bought and cut up for scrap. Racers soon learned that the somewhat small intercoolers could be made to fit their dry lake speed run cars. They used them as after coolers but since they technically were surplus intercoolers. They were called intercoolers. So today when you hear intercooler. People almost always mean aftercooler but like Coke for soda and Kleenex for tissue. The unknowing repeat wrong information enough that people think it is fact.

Raise the hood on any production diesel truck newer than 2000 and you will see a huge head light to head light aluminum radiator looking thing right behind the grill. That is the air to air charge air cooling device commonly known as an intercooler. They need to be huge because they are inefficient. Water to air cooling is actually more efficient. Either way, air or water cooled. Getting the intake air down to 200° is considered good. They also take up a lot of space and are expensive.

If 200° was the goal. I wasn't going to spend thousands and get rid of my A/C to put one on the Cowdog. There are several coolant cooled air charge coolers out there in the $500-$1000 range. But again, if 200° is the best they can do. Why add complexity to the air intake path and more leak opportunities?

Mainly because once installed. Any fixed air charge cooler is "on" all the time and working. It will always make the inlet air cooler than if it wasn't installed. It might not be much, but it will be better than nothing.

There are also consumable methods to cool the air going into the engine. Injecting small amounts of straight water mist into the intake path after the charger can result in around a 10% power increase or similar exhaust gas temperature decrease. Add a 50% methanol/water mix to the air and up to 30% power increases are possible or up to 300° drop in EGT. Again, aviation used this very successfully. Some WWII planes on all sides of the war had such systems installed. Mostly for help during overloaded take offs. Once in the air and the water/meth was consumed. There was no weight penalty for having they system.

Diesel engines seem to really love methanol/water. So do the tuner car guys. There are several companies making kits for diesel trucks and turbo cars. Sifting through all the WRX videos to find truck information is entertaining, but tiresome. I am still researching. But, I think this might be what works for me best. I did make it 1215 miles out of 1225 miles with no issues of wanting more power, speed or less heat in the exhaust. It was only above 3 psi of boost and with an extreme grade that I was having to slow down or even think about it. To me, that is not worth the huge expense/time/effort of fitting a grill mounted air to air or engine bay mounted water to air cooler.

People have cobbled together home made systems for less than $100 and just put tap water in and have it work great. The blue -20° washer fluid is next with a substantial gain in performance without much cost increase. 50/50 methanol/water mixtures are around $10 a gallon and another big step up from the washer fluid performance. Still researching.

Sorry for the extended history lesson. I wanted to make sure an apple was an apple and an orange an orange when someone read what I wrote.
 
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Another Ahab

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2 weeks of research has taught me some things I didn't know before

Sorry for the extended history lesson. I wanted to make sure an apple was an apple and an orange an orange when someone read what I wrote.
Can't believe I read ti all. But I read it all. Always somewthing to know!

Thanks, Barman
 
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