• Steel Soldiers now has a few new forums, read more about it at: New Munitions Forums!

  • Microsoft MSN, Live, Hotmail, Outlook email users may not be receiving emails. We are working to resolve this issue. Please add support@steelsoldiers.com to your trusted contacts.

 

Maryland State Inspection- HMMWV registered as an AM General Pickup

jpfever

Member
65
-1
8
Location
Hagerstown, MD
I have already spoken to who I need to and was informed on what I needed to do to beat the 3 charges, down side, they are only warnings. Should said trooper do it again, I will ask for an actual citation so I can request a hearing. At that point, whether I have a lawyer or not, I can beat all 3 charges. The specialist I spoke to at MVA stated that everything that they see is completely legal and no fraud was committed. The specialist also informed me on what I needed to bring with me to beat the charges.
 

tage

Active member
679
67
28
Location
LOS ANGELES / CALIFORNIA
You guys are talking around a circle. You were given a WARNING, and am complaining. You have no charges filed against you, and have merely an emotional tie to the issue. If you want to contact a lawyer. it's all on you, but It's a good way to dump 20 grand into a hole never to get back.

You do not have to go to court, you were not cited. Why are you making noise? When YOU have actual charges filed against you is when you need to sweat. This is nothing more then a LEO flexing what little power said person has, or think they have.

continue motoring on, and remember. You bought said vehicle as an offroad use only, and clearly states on the SF 97, bill of sale, and hold harmless those words. You can try going off of some caveat to beat this, but ultimately it's the judges choice to how bad you get penalized when YOU get caught... remember federal government trumps local government. AND trust me when I say the state is not going to go against the federal goverment on these type of things as the states rely on billions of dollars in just transportation. IF you're causing too much noise in the clog of the system you will get silenced. just like that cake guy that went to the Supreme Court.
 
Last edited:

TOBASH

Father, Surgeon, Cantankerous Grouch
Steel Soldiers Supporter
3,173
2,800
113
Location
Brooklyn, NY
Perhaps I misunderstood BUT the OP said he was issued a warning "with three violations". The term "violations" to me sounded like a summons was issued.

A warning ain't nothin'.

Sorry for not understanding your terminology.

Ciao
 

jpfever

Member
65
-1
8
Location
Hagerstown, MD
Didnt someone or something state you must pass inspection to haul trailers? If true, how were you not violating that?

I am aware that I was violating the law hauling a trailer, not the point. Do you speed, thus you break the law. Regardless, there are 1st degree and 2nd degree offenses. Is hauling trailer with historic tags in the State of Maryland a 1st degree or 2nd degree offense. If it is a 2nd degree offense, the trooper should not have pulled me over. I have friends in law enforcement who are checking which it is. As I have stated, I have attempted to get my vehicle inspected in the state, inspections in Maryland are 2 fold. Safety first and marginal profit for the inspector. There is nothing in the state of Maryland that dictates the amount charged to perform a safety inspection. Every Inspection station rate varies, any where from $45 and up depending on the type of vehicle.

I'm not sure how controlled state inspections are in Florida, so I won't speak to that. Here in Maryland it is a one time inspection for the life of the vehicle or until it is sold again.
 

jpfever

Member
65
-1
8
Location
Hagerstown, MD
You guys are talking around a circle. You were given a WARNING, and am complaining. You have no charges filed against you, and have merely an emotional tie to the issue. If you want to contact a lawyer. it's all on you, but It's a good way to dump 20 grand into a hole never to get back.
In regards to the Republic, here in Maryland your "Warning" or actual "Citation" is stored in an internal police database for a period of time. That being said, had the trooper given me a warning for the actual violation of hauling a trailer, this would not be an issue. One uneducated or overzealous officer can make one's life **** when driving their vehicle.

You do not have to go to court, you were not cited. Why are you making noise? When YOU have actual charges filed against you is when you need to sweat. This is nothing more then a LEO flexing what little power said person has, or think they have.
You are absolutely correct I don't have to go to court, that is not the point. It was more of an educational experience that I was passing on to my fellow MV collectors on this board and those who visit this board, at the same time informing anyone who passes through the Communist State.



continue motoring on, and remember. You bought said vehicle as an offroad use only, and clearly states on the SF 97, bill of sale, and hold harmless those words. You can try going off of some caveat to beat this, but ultimately it's the judges choice to how bad you get penalized when YOU get caught... remember federal government trumps local government. AND trust me when I say the state is not going to go against the federal goverment on these type of things as the states rely on billions of dollars in just transportation. IF you're causing too much noise in the clog of the system you will get silenced. just like that cake guy that went to the Supreme Court.

Absolutely incorrect statement. Not sure if you are or how new you are to MVs and the process to purchase said vehicles and where else you can purchase them. I in fact did not buy my HMMWV from GovPlanet, I did not sign a Hold Harmless Agreement, I did not have a restriction of "Off Road Use Only" and the SF-97 is not in play, as the Commonwealth of Virginia took it at initial registration, where my vehicle was issued a free and clear (of all restrictions) title. USG does not give a rats A$$ once the vehicle is disposed of unless it is going overseas where export restrictions apply.

In regards to Federal Government versus State Governments, please educate yourself on that matter. It is a shame they took Civics and Government classes out of schools. The Federal Government provides guidance, States can enforce the way the Federal guidance as given or make changes to it and apply them how they see fit for the residents of their state. Look at California gun laws compared to Oregon gun laws. Case in point.

You reference the Cake Guy - he won. From CNN: "The Supreme Court ruled in favor of a Colorado baker who refused to bake a cake to celebrate the marriage of a same sex couple because of a religious objection." Thanks for your 2 cents, but not needed.

Its also a shame that one makes "Rank" on this board. Based on what, the number of posts they put in the forum?
 
Last edited:

jpfever

Member
65
-1
8
Location
Hagerstown, MD
Perhaps I misunderstood BUT the OP said he was issued a warning "with three violations". The term "violations" to me sounded like a summons was issued.

A warning ain't nothin'.

Sorry for not understanding your terminology.

Ciao
Hate to say it, a "Warning" is something that is stored on an internal database that law enforcement officers have access to. The next you are pulled over, the officer can run your tag, see that you have been "Warned" then they could proceed with issuing a citation based on an incorrect Warning. I could care less about the warning - they were just the wrong warning(s) to give. Give me a **** "Warning" about hauling the trailer and let it be. Don't over step your knowledge and look for additional violations that are BS and have no grounds. I don't believe anyone likes to look like a dumba$$ in front of a District Court Judge.

Let the game continue. I will still use my it as an "Occassional Use Only" vehicle, as I have several other vehicles that I use for "Daily Transportation"
 

Ajax MD

Well-known member
1,567
1,414
113
Location
Mayo, MD
I'm jumping into this discussion because the thread is not very old and I find myself in the same position. Frankly, I wish I'd found the thread before purchasing this M998 for my wife. It may end up becoming an expensive yard ornament.

I do have some experience in titling and registering odd-ball vehicles in the state of Maryland with VINs that are not 17 digits. Here is what's needed:

1. It really, really helps if you have a clear, on-road title instead of juggling an SF-97 with the "off road only" designation.
2. For non-standard VINs, you have to ask for a "supervisor override." Usually, the desk clerk knows to ask for it so you may not have to do anything.
3. If the MVA clerks title the vehicle, then you have not committed fraud (as long as you haven't lied about the VIN or anything).

That's the titling aspect. Now onto tags and safety inspection:

My wife's M998 is titled as a 2002. Thus it does not even qualify for Historic tags in Maryland and requires a safety inspection.

So what? Plenty of people prefer to register classic cars with regular use tags so that they are not restricted in their enjoyment of the vehicle. The safety inspection station must deal with the non-standard VIN. The vehicle must pass the safety inspection based on the ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT. My understanding is that the owner cannot be forced to retro-fit the vehicle up to modern standards (air bags, ABS, reverse lights etc) but I'm searching for hard proof on this point.

To deal with all of this, the safety inspection station may need to contact their "supervising trooper" who oversees their safety inspection station just to inform them that they'll be inspecting a vehicle with a non-standard VIN and perhaps non-standard safety equipment. An odd-ball VIN has nothing to do with whether or not they can inspect your HMMWV:

How do I obtain a Maryland Inspection Certificate for my vehicle?

To obtain an inspection certificate, you must have your vehicle inspected at an authorized safety inspection station in Maryland. The Maryland State Police has licensed approximately 1,600 of these facilities in all parts of the state. Click here to find an inspection station near you that can provide an inspection for your type of vehicle. Most stations are authorized to inspect:

  • Passenger cars;
  • Light trucks and SUV’s with a gross vehicle weight rating of 10,000 pounds or less

Oddly, the hurdle that I am running into, is that the safety inspection stations are telling me that the truck is too wide for their lifts and that they must use the lift to inspect the vehicle. I have been advised to contact a truck inspection station and ask them to inspect it.

A HMMWV is nothing more than a 1 1/4 ton pickup truck, same as an M715, an M880, or an F-250.

In Maryland, diesel small trucks were not subject to VEIP (emission) inspections until 2009 so if your HMMWV is older than 2009, you should never receive a notice from VEIP or be required to produce an emissions certificate.

I will report back once I have more details on exactly what modern equipment may be required for the safety inspection, if any.

I'll tell you this- There is a local fellow in Lothian who is an MV flipper. He claims all of his vehicles sell with on-road titles and I'll bet they don't all have Historic tags. He's getting it done somehow and I'll bet it's legal or he would have drawn the attention of state law by now: http://surplusmilitarydepot.com/category/hmmwv/
 

98G

Former SSG
Steel Soldiers Supporter
5,845
3,885
113
Location
AZ/KS/MO/OK/NM/NE, varies by the day...
I'm jumping into this discussion because the thread is not very old and I find myself in the same position. Frankly, I wish I'd found the thread before purchasing this M998 for my wife. It may end up becoming an expensive yard ornament.

I do have some experience in titling and registering odd-ball vehicles in the state of Maryland with VINs that are not 17 digits. Here is what's needed:

1. It really, really helps if you have a clear, on-road title instead of juggling an SF-97 with the "off road only" designation.
2. For non-standard VINs, you have to ask for a "supervisor override." Usually, the desk clerk knows to ask for it so you may not have to do anything.
3. If the MVA clerks title the vehicle, then you have not committed fraud (as long as you haven't lied about the VIN or anything).

That's the titling aspect. Now onto tags and safety inspection:

My wife's M998 is titled as a 2002. Thus it does not even qualify for Historic tags in Maryland and requires a safety inspection.

So what? Plenty of people prefer to register classic cars with regular use tags so that they are not restricted in their enjoyment of the vehicle. The safety inspection station must deal with the non-standard VIN. The vehicle must pass the safety inspection based on the ORIGINAL EQUIPMENT. My understanding is that the owner cannot be forced to retro-fit the vehicle up to modern standards (air bags, ABS, reverse lights etc) but I'm searching for hard proof on this point.

To deal with all of this, the safety inspection station may need to contact their "supervising trooper" who oversees their safety inspection station just to inform them that they'll be inspecting a vehicle with a non-standard VIN and perhaps non-standard safety equipment. An odd-ball VIN has nothing to do with whether or not they can inspect your HMMWV:


Oddly, the hurdle that I am running into, is that the safety inspection stations are telling me that the truck is too wide for their lifts and that they must use the lift to inspect the vehicle. I have been advised to contact a truck inspection station and ask them to inspect it.

A HMMWV is nothing more than a 1 1/4 ton pickup truck, same as an M715, an M880, or an F-250.

In Maryland, diesel small trucks were not subject to VEIP (emission) inspections until 2009 so if your HMMWV is older than 2009, you should never receive a notice from VEIP or be required to produce an emissions certificate.

I will report back once I have more details on exactly what modern equipment may be required for the safety inspection, if any.

I'll tell you this- There is a local fellow in Lothian who is an MV flipper. He claims all of his vehicles sell with on-road titles and I'll bet they don't all have Historic tags. He's getting it done somehow and I'll bet it's legal or he would have drawn the attention of state law by now: http://surplusmilitarydepot.com/category/hmmwv/

Looks like you have a law in MD specifically prohibiting all MV's -

 

AOR

Member
134
23
18
Location
Burtonsville, MD.
Here are facts
I live in MD. I own a 1986 M998 titled in MD
it came with an IA on road title and when I tried to register it I was told MD no longer is registering former military vehicles or armored vehicles
I went to the main MVA is Glen Burnie and the person I was supposed to speak with was not there. They asked me what they wanted them to do and I said I would like to register it and drive it and the asked me how I plan to use it. I told her that I volunteer for an organization for wounded veterans and take them and their families off road "True" she smiled and asked me if I wanted to pay cash or credit.

I have only driven it a few hundred miles since May of 2018
I have it registered with Historic tags

Unfortunately yours being a 2002 model it will absolutely need to pass MD state inspection before it can get tags and historic tags will not be an option until it is 20 years old.

Keep us posted how the inspection goes I strongly suggest getting functional backup lights and a rear tag light
 

Milcommoguy

Well-known member
Supporting Vendor
1,649
2,084
113
Location
Rosamond, CA
Interesting reading... Seems we all could in up with expensive yard art.

You can have my HUMMWV when... CAMO
 

98G

Former SSG
Steel Soldiers Supporter
5,845
3,885
113
Location
AZ/KS/MO/OK/NM/NE, varies by the day...
Are they planning on confiscating all previously titled and tagged MV's? That's a lot of vehicles.

No, they wont confiscate. They'll just revoke your plates and send you a letter. Their ban isn't on possession. The ban is on operation.

Paraphrased " you can have it. You just can't drive it on the roads."

Enforcement will be spotty and patchy.
 

Ajax MD

Well-known member
1,567
1,414
113
Location
Mayo, MD
No, they wont confiscate. They'll just revoke your plates and send you a letter. Their ban isn't on possession. The ban is on operation.

Paraphrased " you can have it. You just can't drive it on the roads."

Enforcement will be spotty and patchy.
True, but that's not how I intend to operate.

I'll post future comments on the thread in the "MV Politics" forum as it is the more appropriate forum for this discussion.
 

Ajax MD

Well-known member
1,567
1,414
113
Location
Mayo, MD
I'd like to clear up this bit of myth.

Titling:

If you have an SF-97 without the "Off-road Use Only" stamp OR a legal, on-road title from any state, Maryland will title your HMMWV. The clerk will need to obtain a "supervisor override" to enter the VIN because it is not 17 digits. Simply explain that it is a surplus military vehicle auctioned to the public. Tell them that it is 10k GVWR or less (unless you have one of the heavy models).

NON-HISTORIC Registration:

(Standard passenger vehicle tags)

At the time of titling, the Maryland MVA will issue you a 30-day tag for the purposes of obtaining a safety inspection.

Obtaining a Vehicle Safety Inspection:

First- the ASED bulletin referred to in post #49 above, is irrelevant and illegal. It is not grounded in any existing or pending legislation in Maryland. I'm working with a Maryland House delegate who flatly stated that the MSP/ASED cannot do this. It is an attempt to legislate from an agency and is overreach.

Second- After communicating with nearly a dozen vehicle safety inspection stations, not a single one was even aware of this bulletin. Not a single station refused to inspect my vehicle based upon this bulletin or the lack of a 17 digit, Federal VIN. Several stations refused to inspect my truck for the following reasons: "Not familiar with the vehicle"/"Don't have a lift that can accommodate the width"/"Not interested in inspecting this vehicle." The faulty bulletin isn't even being enforced as far as I can tell.

That's right. In Maryland, a safety inspector can refuse to inspect your vehicle simply because they don't want to. They are private shops, not government employees. Never was the bulletin used as a reason for refusal. When I brought it up, they'd never heard of it.

Lastly, I found an inspection station/shop nearby that works on classic and custom cars. They are used to unusual vehicles. I asked the inspector if he was willing to inspect the truck. He said yes. I had a detailed conversation with him about the truck's oddities (location of brakes, geared hubs, lack of "Park" pawl and operation of the 3-lever light switch. The inspector said "No problem, I understand."

You WILL:
Need to add the following equipment in order to pass inspection in Maryland:
- Interior rearview mirror
- Reverse lights
- Patch the "field mod" drain holes cut into your floor pan by gun shots or pick-axes

I flunked my inspection today for a sloppy U-joint. I've ordered the part, the inspector will install it tomorrow and I'll be on my way. I will take my safety inspection ticket to the MVA and obtain my 2-year, regular passenger tag. Not Historic, no restrictions.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

- In this process at no point did I lie, dissemble or omit to any government official or inspector.
- Nobody heard of the bulletin, nobody cared about the bulletin. Nobody cared about the lack of a 17 digit VIN, except to obtain the supervisor override.
- I did all my own paperwork, I did not use a titling service or contractor.
- I used the Annapolis main branch of the Motor Vehicle Administration which is known for being difficult to work with.
- Essentially, I followed the same legal process that Mission BBQ uses to title and register their M35A3 trucks as catering trucks.

If you follow the "Politics in MV's" forum, you are aware that I am working with sympathetic delegates to pass legislation that will protect all FMV's from this kind of bogus police and agency overreach, INCLUDING HMMVWs with the "offroad" restriction. That process is still ongoing. (HB-1148)

If you PM me, I can refer you to my inspector who is now very familiar and comfortable with HMMWV's.
 

rockDAWG

Member
86
26
18
Location
Delaware
I'd like to clear up this bit of myth.

.....................

- In this process at no point did I lie, dissemble or omit to any government official or inspector.
- Nobody heard of the bulletin, nobody cared about the bulletin. Nobody cared about the lack of a 17 digit VIN, except to obtain the supervisor override.
- I did all my own paperwork, I did not use a titling service or contractor.
- I used the Annapolis main branch of the Motor Vehicle Administration which is known for being difficult to work with.
- Essentially, I followed the same legal process that Mission BBQ uses to title and register their M35A3 trucks as catering trucks.

If you follow the "Politics in MV's" forum, you are aware that I am working with sympathetic delegates to pass legislation that will protect all FMV's from this kind of bogus police and agency overreach, INCLUDING HMMVWs with the "offroad" restriction. That process is still ongoing. (HB-1148)

If you PM me, I can refer you to my inspector who is now very familiar and comfortable with HMMWV's.
Ajax MD,
Thanks for taking time for this post. (y)
 
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website like our supporting vendors. Their ads help keep Steel Soldiers going. Please consider disabling your ad blockers for the site. Thanks!

I've Disabled AdBlock
No Thanks