Weight carrying capacity of a bobbed deuce!?!

[neil2007]

Hello!!!

I'm looking to bob my deuce but am wondering if it will have the carrying capacity to carry my Willy's CJ2A Trail Rig. I would think it would, but I figured I'd ask those more in the know than I!

I would have a custom bed that would center the Willy's over the rear axle. The weight of the Willy's is around 4200 lbs when it's not coated in a thick gooey coating of Indiana Clay Mud!

What do ya'll think??

Thanks for your time!


Neil

 

[Recovry4x4]

Once modified, it's anybodys guess. How are you going to bob it? Front springs, trailer springs? Trailer subframe approach? I would consider the trailer subframe method with it's wider stance more suitable for carrying the Jeep. What tire configuration are you considering?

 

[neil2007]

Once modified, it's anybodys guess. How are you going to bob it? Front springs, trailer springs? Trailer subframe approach? I would consider the trailer subframe method with it's wider stance more suitable for carrying the Jeep. What tire configuration are you considering?

I was hoping to do the front springs approach or maybe get a new main leaf with eyes to add to the existing rear springs and remove a few leafs to get it to about 1/2 to 3/4 of what it currently would be. Then add appropriate spring mounts and hangers as needed. I would prefer to keep everything attached directly to the main frame rails instead of using sub-assembly's. I just like knowing that there are that many less points of stress to watch from broken bolts or mounts. But I'll be honest, I haven't looked into the trailer sub frame method yet... I'll take a look at it and see what I think...

What kind of rating are the trailer springs rated at?

I'll be running the super singles like I currently have.

Thanks!


Neil

 

[Recovry4x4]

What current tires do you have? Are they rated for the weight? The weight on the front of a deuce is nearly 7000#. The front springs will squat a bit from the Jeep. Phil2968 has a bobbed deuce with front springs and last year he toted a 3000# chunk of engine to the GA Rally and it flattened the heck out of his springs. M105 springs are nearly identical to the deuce front springs. If used with the subframe approach they have overload springs and wider stance. The highway rating for a deuce is 10,000# so the single axle is very capable of the 5000# payload but it's all going to hinge on your spring selection. What are your plans for a bed and how long is the Jeep?

 

[neil2007]

What current tires do you have? Are they rated for the weight? The weight on the front of a deuce is nearly 7000#. The front springs will squat a bit from the Jeep. Phil2968 has a bobbed deuce with front springs and last year he toted a 3000# chunk of engine to the GA Rally and it flattened the heck out of his springs. M105 springs are nearly identical to the deuce front springs. If used with the subframe approach they have overload springs and wider stance. The highway rating for a deuce is 10,000# so the single axle is very capable of the 5000# payload but it's all going to hinge on your spring selection. What are your plans for a bed and how long is the Jeep?

I'm not sure of the specifics of the tires, but they are the factory super singles that were on the older Deuce Fire Trucks... I think they are 11.00 r 20's... if memory serves me right... http://530B.letsgettwisted.com (if you want to see what I am starting with...)

I was thinking of building a bed that would allow the Jeeps tires to sit down into deep wells so I'm lower than the 12' Legal limit for Indiana... :0 It's kind of a tall Jeep! The bed overall would weigh about 500 lbs... it would be very minimalistic with just treads for where the tires would need to sit. The Axle on the deuce would sit between the two Jeep tires, so that would probably mean I'd have a long bobbed deuce (I think the Jeep is 15 Ft, which if my estimation is correct, would put me needing to have the axle in place of where the current rear axle of the tandems would be... that may be too long for what I want in reality), IF I do it this way... I may end up just bobbing the deuce and planning on hauling the Jeep on it's own trailer instead. But I liked the idea at one time of the Willy's being on the back without a trailer... BUT I also like the idea of keeping the Deuce's suspension soft enough to be able to drive it on a semi daily basis unloaded if I want.

I am repowering it with a Fuel Injected 5.8 L (Ford 351 Windsor) and an Auto Over Drive tranny, so the front may end up being a lot lighter than a standard deuce...

SO, we know that a single axle CAN hold the weight I need given the right spring configuration... but physically, it may be work out to be longer than I want the bobbed deuce to be.... If it's going to be that long anyways, mis-well keep the dual axle setup and put a full rollback on it. :/

Thanks for the info! I think it has helped me a lot!


Neil

 

[RedbeardTheZombieHunter]

The two-and-a-half ton and five ton ratings on all military trucks are off-highway ratings and are doubled for on-highway use. I was under the impression that the trailers are rated the same way. The M105 is a one-and-a-half ton rated trailer so it should be fully capable of three tons on-highway making it capable of 6000 pounds. I seem to recall someone telling me if you dual the wheels on the M105, you can carry 10,000 pounds (if you can pack that much weight into that nine-foot bed). Following that reasoning, a bobbed deuce with trailer springs should be capable of the same numbers. Weather or not you use the trailer sub-frame is irrelivant to the weight capacity, but rather only changes the ride height.

 

[6x6guy]

When I was in the service_ I asked the motor pool sargent how much is too much- his reply - (You can't put enough weight in those trucks- it just makes it harder to steer and brake thats all).

 

[sandcobra164]

OK, I hate it when people pull this card at work. I'm going to play "Devils Advocate". You're going to take a dual rear axle truck and make it into a single rear axle truck. You're going to switch from dual rear tires on the remaining axle to single tires that are 11R20's. The tires were a popular upgrade and many trucks were singled out "so to speak" by the military. 6 tires on the ground versus 10, flipping hubs so those 11R20's stayed in track with the front tires. That was a nice idea and it worked.

Now onto the "Devils Advocate" part. You will be cutting vital parts of the frame, removing rivets and basically "going on your own" with any bob. It's hard enough to get insurance on a factory built M35. I even had insurance on mine from Geico. When they dropped me, I made a few call's and they basically told me that all I had was a paper card, if it had ever been in an accident, they would have the pics to prove, "They don't cover that". My truck is bone stock with the exception of a muffler and LED lights that work properly. Insurance companies look for any exception to the rule. That is why I have the "Anti Bobber" stance. 3DAngus has an awesome bobber with an M105 bed and springs. I like the looks of it and it really is a nice truck. I'd never bob one out of concern of insurance which enough of us have a hard enough time getting on stock trucks. When you start modifying these trucks, you open your back door to alot of liability.

 

[JasonS]

Insurance companies who don't understand what they are insuring will give you an answer like that. Find someone else.

 

[quickfarms]

Weigth carrying capacity of a bobbed deuce!?!

Personally I am against bobbing a duece using either front springs, trailer springs or a trailer sub frame. All of these methods will significantly reduce the load capacity of the rear axle and truck.

If you really want to bob a duece and do it correctly, per DOT standards, you need to use the rear suspension off of a civilian medium duty two axle truck and you need to ether move or add frame crossmembers.

 

[ryan77]

Why dont you just leave it stock???Get some nice singles and u will have a nice truck with no structural issues!!

 

[JasonS]

Personally I am against bobbing a duece using either front springs, trailer springs or a trailer sub frame. All of these methods will significantly reduce the load capacity of the rear axle and truck.

If you really want to bob a duece and do it correctly, per DOT standards, you need to use the rear suspension off of a civilian medium duty two axle truck and you need to ether move or add frame crossmembers.

So, you are claiming that there is DOT language specifically indicating this? Care to post a link? A previous post indicated that there is 7k lbs on the front axle. My bobbed deuce weights 10k; therefore, there is 3k on the rear axle. Run the math on the remaining capacity for the rear axle.

 

[desert demon]

Here in Utah just got my M35A2 bobber last friday and got my insurance threw kemper. $150 every 6 months for liabilty only.Sents pics of truck no issues with it.

 

[swbradley1]

Here in Utah just got my M35A2 bobber last friday and got my insurance threw kemper. $150 every 6 months for liabilty only.Sents pics of truck no issues with it.

Can you post some more pics of your truck? It looks like it has a longer frame.

 

[73m819]

Here in Utah just got my M35A2 bobber last friday and got my insurance threw kemper. $150 every 6 months for liabilty only.Sents pics of truck no issues with it.

Did the insurance co. KNOW that it was a HIGHLY moded truck, or just insured the truck in the picture ?/?/

 

[zout]

opcorn:

 

[jsthnt@gmail.com]

The bed of my bobbed deuce General Granite box was made to haul a suzuki in it. the tail gate was made to be basically a bed extension. If you are going to have it sit down to reduce the overal height, what are you going to do with the fuel tank?

 

[11Echo]

Data plate I had seen for the XM381 deuce listed it as a 2 ton cargo truck. It listed it's empty weight at 10,300lbs.
The off road loaded gvw listed was 15,310
It had a total highway gvw of 17,750lbs.
I believe the rear axle weights were augmented with auxilliary spring set included.

 

[rmgill]

The two-and-a-half ton and five ton ratings on all military trucks are off-highway ratings and are doubled for on-highway use. I was under the impression that the trailers are rated the same way. The M105 is a one-and-a-half ton rated trailer so it should be fully capable of three tons on-highway making it capable of 6000 pounds. I seem to recall someone telling me if you dual the wheels on the M105, you can carry 10,000 pounds (if you can pack that much weight into that nine-foot bed). Following that reasoning, a bobbed deuce with trailer springs should be capable of the same numbers. Weather or not you use the trailer sub-frame is irrelivant to the weight capacity, but rather only changes the ride height.

It is my understanding that the Trailer weights are NOT doubled for on road use.

the -14&P for the M105A3 lists 3000 lbs highway and cross country for payload.
the -14&P for the M796 lists 8000 lbs payload for both highway and cross country.
Same for the M353A1, 7000lbs payload. No differentiation for highway vs cross country.
The M979 and 1061s both appear to list 10,000 lbs and the M17073 lists 15000 lbs for payload.


Now, the M200A1 does list 5000 lbs cross country and 7000 lbs highway....
And the M101's list 1500 lbs cross country and 2250 highway.

Doubling trailer capacities is probably inadvisable as you're well into your safety factors then.

 

[brianp454]

I concur.

Personally I am against bobbing a duece using either front springs, trailer springs or a trailer sub frame. All of these methods will significantly reduce the load capacity of the rear axle and truck.

If you really want to bob a duece and do it correctly, per DOT standards, you need to use the rear suspension off of a civilian medium duty two axle truck and you need to ether move or add frame crossmembers.