Starter turns when key out of ignition

[cucvrus]

Unplugging te relay poses no problems. It stops the starter from turning. Unless it is stuck out in the flex plate. Then cable cutters/battery cables are cheaper then a wiring harness. These are the stop all tools used by emergency workers all over the world. Battery cables can be easily repaired.

 

[cucvrus]

Having given serious thought to a battery cut off, it is more complicated than is practical, a 24V cut off is a big switch that is not easily mounted and not easily protected from shorts and just cutting off 12V during a run on can cause worse or further damage I have heard. When my run on happened the batteries shot out molten lead and acid, and it wasn't exactly like I wanted to be messing around with a shut off at the time and running it into the cab meant further potential failures from a cable rubbing through, being too long and higher resistance or a short across the terminals. In the end, I just rebuilt everything back to new, I already had done the doghead mod and I upgraded all the battery cables to one gauge up. It was a pain and time consuming, but now I just pay attention to the battery gauge and if it is in the yellow and not just when the glow plugs are running, I wouldn't turn the key. My issue was a fused solenoid contact on the starter and not the relay and my fatal flaw was keeping old crappy batteries because I wanted to do batteries last after I had everything else fixed so I would not potentially ruin batteries with a lot of down time on a vehicle I was working on. I would have been money ahead changing the batteries twice in hindsight.

BINGO. Give this man the prize. That is the only time I have seen issues with the stock set up. Low batteries. You my friend are a genius. Thank you. Thank you.

 

[74M35A2]

That relay is fine. Best wishes to the OP, polite of everybody else to stay along and help. Welded starter solenoid contacts can and do happen.

 

[cucvrus]

If you were to but a battery cut off on a CUCV. You could put a big HD Cole Hersee? ? on the single cable going to the battery and it could be anywhere you wanted it to be mounted. And flip it off if something starter related was happening that you were not wanting to happen. I never done it but it would work and the truck would work fine all day long after starter. So big switch on. Start the truck. Big switch off and live happily ever after. Am I missing anything? And would that wire not powering the starter after starting effect anything? I used the same starter to start 2 trucks after a sale once. I removed the starter after the first CUCV truck was started. Put it on the second and was on our way. I did it in the rest area of I 77. Drove back to PA 8 more hours. Everything worked out. I am asking if I am missing something? Random debate that is all. Not facts but in theory it would work.

 

[Rvitko]

I had the same line of thought but those big switches are huge and I was worried that god forbid I drop a tool or one gets up under the dash or something metal comes loose I could end up with a screwdriver or wrench arc welded across the terminals. It would take about a 3" pipe to build some sort of enclosure for it and that is a big thing to try to mount and seal up, I had wanted to put it under the drivers side frame so I could jump up quick and jump out and flip it and not drill up my dash, so then it has to be sealed against water getting in. Maybe someone else can find a way and I believe those big Cole Hearse switches work awesome on a bulldozer or bus where there is a wide open space under the dash, but with the AC and a brake controller on mine, all that space is gone and I try to do everything so it can be undone and not be jacked up for the next guy. I might be overthinking all this, but I try really hard to not make myself more problems than I started with.

 

[doghead]

The issue is there are three connections that need to be disconnected at once.

No issues with pulling a starter out after it starts, if you need to.

 

[Rvitko]

I should clarify, my intention was not to cut off all electrical, just the main 24V leg to the starter. In the end, it is as many have said before, if you take care of your batteries and everything is in order, it isn't needed.

 

[cucvrus]

Just put the switch on the floor. The terminal will be under the truck. I have installed thousands on trucks for lift gate, battery shut off and winch power. They do not need any heavy protection. A bit of terminal spray and a tight greased connection is all it takes. And yes you can just switch the main power cable to the starter and call it a day. If you done it on the passengers side it would be even easier. Just switch it off if you have an issue. Hope that helps. Have a great day. The switch I pictured is very HD and cost about $40. beats the pants off of hacking into the main dash harness. If it helps give peace to the mind.

We can call it the Cole Hersse battery cut off mod.

 

[doghead]

If you have a stuck starter solenoid, or bendix,or stuck under-dash relay and you disconnect the battery supply to the starter motor, your solenoid supply wire(small one) could then take over and it is not sufficient for the motor load(the starter will continue to run).

Fire will soon follow.

You can't cover all the possibilities with one switch.

We have discussed this and other possible scenarios in the past.

 

[doghead]

One other possible issue the OP may have that has not been mentioned is the steering column key mechanism and switch, it could have been his original problem.

I think he mentioned he tested his under-dash relay and found fault there but with his experiance and communication shortcomings, I am still concerned that he may not have found his original fault that caused his starter to run-on.

 

[cucvrus]

So with that all said. Reversing the mounting of the stock relay under the dash would be another easy option. I am not sure I understand how cutting 24 volt to the starter would not stop the action but I guess anything and any scenario is possible. I am not sure how I have not had any of these problems over the years. it boggles the mind. I guess going back to god strong batteries is part of the reason why it never happens to me. I sell batteries. So I never let them get low. I think we have this problem beat to death so hard the OP has his head spinning. Everyone, Peace out.

 

[doghead]

Simply said, if you read the forums here , you will find well over a 100 people(actual amount is probably much higher) that have experienced starter run-on.

The doghead relay modification definitely will help eliminate this from ever happening(before it happens).

Other situations can still occur that will allow it to happen.

Nothing is fool proof.

I'm 100% sure that I have helped hundreds of people with this idea.

 

[Paycheck]

I didn't think of ignition feels lil stuff but I chalked it up to be an older vehicle, I'll replace it also thanks for the information


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[The FLU farm]

I never done it but it would work and the truck would work fine all day long after starter. So big switch on. Start the truck. Big switch off and live happily ever after. Am I missing anything?

Cutting the cable to the starter couldn't hurt a thing, as far as I can tell. But disconnecting the batteries (negative or positive side) with the engine running would make the alternators unhappy, wouldn't it?

 

[doghead]

reread the first statement in post # 89.

 

[doghead]

The alternators should not be affected if the batteries are disconnected.

 

[The FLU farm]

reread the first statement in post # 89.

I thought CUCVRUS meant that this was once the engine was running, and without stuck relays or starter solenoids, or other malfunctions.

 

[gimpyrobb]

I thought CUCVRUS meant that this was once the engine was running, and without stuck relays or starter solenoids, or other malfunctions.

Hmmm
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kTcRRaXV-fg

 

[rustystud]

Simply said, if you read the forums here , you will find well over a 100 people(actual amount is probably much higher) that have experienced starter run-on.

The doghead relay modification definitely will help eliminate this from ever happening(before it happens).

Other situations can still occur that will allow it to happen.

Nothing is fool proof.

I'm 100% sure that I have helped hundreds of people with this idea.

Your correct about this problem. GM had this issue for several years in the 1980's with quite a few trucks. I have just installed a higher amp relay in all the 1980's GM trucks I have owned ( 5 now) . Another major problem GM had with their starters was "heat soak" . Shut off the vehicle after driving for awhile and the starter would not work. Installing heat shields helps, but going with larger relays and power cables works even better.

 

[doghead]

I thought CUCVRUS meant that this was once the engine was running, and without stuck relays or starter solenoids, or other malfunctions.

If there was no malfunction(need for emergency action), why would you cut the wire with wire cutters?