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Out for a warm up and a full fuel top off. The BOT is awesome. Excellent rig.
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Steel Soldiers now has a few new forums, read more about it at: New Munitions Forums!
Superthermal's M813 Build, THE BOT
- Thread starter Superthermal
- Start date
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- Wenatchee, WA
I like it!
I drove mine to work yesterday and it just ran super smooth; no vibrations, rattles or tire hopping and felt like really strong power. Not sure if it was the temps or what but everything was working superb!
I drove mine to work yesterday and it just ran super smooth; no vibrations, rattles or tire hopping and felt like really strong power. Not sure if it was the temps or what but everything was working superb!
- 325
- 878
- 93
- Location
- Utah, Murray, United States
I have purchased 3 Detroit lockers for the axles and three sets of Konig chains for my 16.00R20s. I will be attempting to make the "track" chains discussed back a ways in my thread.
I will start installing the lockers on Monday with the help of another SS member. I need to pull my S-280 out and then remove the cargo bed. This will allow me to remove the chunks from the top through the top of the frame. The front is a bit more tricky. Will be lifting the front of the rig off the ground, removing the front tires, and resting the rear of the springs on railroad ties and some 2x12s . Ill take the drums off and the steering arms off the top of the knuckles then undo the front U-bolts. Then with some luck I can slide the axle out from under the front of the rig so the surgery can take place.
Wish me luck.
I will start installing the lockers on Monday with the help of another SS member. I need to pull my S-280 out and then remove the cargo bed. This will allow me to remove the chunks from the top through the top of the frame. The front is a bit more tricky. Will be lifting the front of the rig off the ground, removing the front tires, and resting the rear of the springs on railroad ties and some 2x12s . Ill take the drums off and the steering arms off the top of the knuckles then undo the front U-bolts. Then with some luck I can slide the axle out from under the front of the rig so the surgery can take place.
Wish me luck.
Attachments
- 1,240
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- 113
- Location
- Wenatchee, WA
Now that's an ambitious task...good luck!
- 325
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- Utah, Murray, United States
Well that took longer than i thought it would for the two rears. Will finish putting back on the driveshafts today.
- 1,240
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- Wenatchee, WA
Is there any shimming to do after the swap or is it just a carrier change over?
- 325
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- Utah, Murray, United States
There is a great video done by yhe Western Canadian Rockwell guys on Youtube on how to do a chunk inspection. In yhis video they cover the details on a 2 1/2ton chunk but point out along the way yhe differences with the 5 ton. Very helpful.
- 325
- 878
- 93
- Location
- Utah, Murray, United States
Getting the last locker installed in yhe front axle. Would be "easier" if I was doing a big cam swap and just pulling the chunk out the hood rather than havimg to pull yhe entire axle out from under the rig. The UBolts were an absolute bear. Everything else was smooth to this point. Will get the chunk pulled tomorrow and the locker installed.
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- Wenatchee, WA
It feels good watching other people tackle hard projects and make progress all from the safety of my phone...hehehe.
Keep it up!
Keep it up!
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- Utah, Murray, United States
No kidding this was a bit much to bite off, but was able to punch the leaky inner seals out, replace the boots and put the locker into the chunk clean everything up on the top loader, reinstall the chunk and do some clean up of tools etc... On Saturday Looking to finish. Will be getting the axle back under, get the new inter seals installed, replace all the brake lines, drums back in place among a million other things.
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- Utah, Murray, United States
Driving with the two rear lockers I honestly could not tell any difference on dry pavement. Truck turns same as always and no tire dragging due to the lockers being able to free spool the faster rotating tire.
Will be using my 1x4 air hose assembly I made back a bit to ensure that all 4 of these rear tires are kept at the exact same air pressure to try to ensure they all wear evenly. Will also connect the two fronts to do the same. (See the part I used in the item #10 of this post:
Will be using my 1x4 air hose assembly I made back a bit to ensure that all 4 of these rear tires are kept at the exact same air pressure to try to ensure they all wear evenly. Will also connect the two fronts to do the same. (See the part I used in the item #10 of this post:
Superthermal's M813 Build, THE BOT
Had been looking for some time for an M813 with winch. Not much luck and was always behind another buyer it seemed. Finally found one in decent shape and an excellent price but on the other side of the US from me. The rig was located near Detroit. I know that is a long ways away but I bought...
www.steelsoldiers.com
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What pressures are you running front & rear?
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- Utah, Murray, United States
The front is at 60 and the 4 rears are at 52. My tires were new with the fuzzies on them and I found that running anything more than this that the tire side lugs were not wearing the same as the center section of the tires. When at the above psi the side fuzzies began to wear evenly with the rest of the tire. Now that was with the bed empty and no S-280 shelter in it. But I haven't adjusted the pressure since. If you don't have fuzzies to wear off your tires you can put some paint or heavy chalk on your tire in a line across or on several of the lugs and see how the chalk/paint wears off as you drive. You want it to be as even as possible to ensure full contact of the tire for the longest wear life.
How about you? Your front winch weighs almost 800lbs in all. What are you finding suits your setup?
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- Wenatchee, WA
I'm running 60 in front, 35 in rear and 40 in the middle for now, but I still experiment with different rear settings. Truck is empty.
I like the chalk/paint idea - will have to try that out.
I like the chalk/paint idea - will have to try that out.
- 325
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- Utah, Murray, United States
Bought two 8D batteries to ensure cold starts are solid.
Still need a winch. If I can find the rest of the parts on this side of the country for the winch I already have then great! But since that is looking to be a hard find, I have been considering a 24 Volt 25K Sherpa Stallion winch for $1999. I would mount it on top of the frame rails in-front of the grill out of harms way. This would make me consider change some items for my charging system, 8D batteries can only take in about 60 amps charge anyway so the stock 60 amp generator should be fine, but having a one wire 33si that does 100 amps wouldn't hurt my feelings any when the draw of the winch at max would be 210 amps at 24V.
I did pick up a remote brake fluid reservoir for my master cylinder and a cool valve setup for the front sprag disconnect to freewheel the front axle. I'll install those when it is a bit warmer out.
Still considering the big jump to a Hydromax brake system. My notes on getting this done are here in an old thread I had found, I put my notes on how the system would be installed on my M813 if I jump into it. The thread is a good long read for info on how the Hydromax system works.
I'm going to put a copy of my notes here, for safe keeping and editing here rather than on that thread.
. Hydro max 2" piston unit with 50/50 proportioning and a 24V booster. There are models with a pressure differential switch to notify a warning light letting you know there is a problem, and it has a low level brake fluid sensor. I am not sure I care for either of the options but the proportioning is needed.
www.powerbrakeservice.net
. Firewall mount Wilwood pedal assembly or similar (I would be getting the double peddle 7:1 mechanical advantage unit and using the 2nd peddle to install a hydraulic clutch assembly which would remove the "flex play" out of the stock linkage that annoys me when wheeling when the body and frame flex independent of each other. I need to verify the Hydromax booster will be able to bolt on the firewall side of the peddle, I haven't been able to find a bolt patten layout for the Hydromax boosters... so this could change.
Peddle pair link:
Clutch Master Cylinder link:
Clutch Slave Cylinder link:
This Clutch slave cylinder has only a 1.36" Stroke, I may need more than that... Will look into it.
. Flexible brake line hoses from proportioning valve/or MC to frame rails as this M813 flexes like no other and the lines cannot be hard lined down to the frame.
. Trailer brake mod to keep trailer brake function if I actually ever get a trailer. I already have a hand operated trailer air brake arm, which is intended to be mounted on steering column. Since I see no other sensible/affordable easy to install options this is all I think I would need.
.15lb Residual pressure valves for the brake lines if using drums still and 2lb for disc brakes.
On my M813 I would totally want at the same time to swap to disc brakes. All dreaming here. From what I have researched the F750 10 stud discs with the 4 piston calipers look like a solid fit. To do this mod I would flip my rear hubs, run long lug nut studs through the disc brake, then through the hub. I would then bolt/weld some caliper mounting plates to the axles. This way the disc and caliper will be tucked up inside the wheel and out of harms way.
A bonus from flipping the hub, is my rig with HEMTT wheels on all 6 tires are inset in the rear. Normally people put them on just the front axle to keep 16.00R20 tires from hitting quite so much on the steering box cover due to their 1 1/2 or 2" offset from stock 5 ton rims, but if you run them on all 6 the fronts are offset out from stock and the rears are inset from stock giving the rig a narrower rear tracking of the tires. I would prefer a wide track in the rear as well so flipping the hub is desired which will make the track width same front and rear but being wider by that 1 1/2 or 2" offest the HEMTT wheels give.
END OF HYDROBRAKE THREAD.
From the Disc Brake Conversion thread, one of our SS members pulled some info that was helpful which I was drawing from:
Here is the link to his thread:
This is the rotor that I think would be best to run, Two apparent sources:
www.finditparts.com
www.napaonline.com
This is the stud that I believe will be long enough to go through the rotor, the spindle and then through the HEMTT wheel I don't have one of the rotors to see what the stud shoulder size is but I think it is the same as the 5 ton. I am guessing I would finally need to buy the correct wheel nuts that sit inset into the wheel when doing this too. I havn't checked the knurl size so these two parts may need revising.
Need left and right versions.
This is the caliper that appears to be the best choice, 4 piston, plate mountable, 6 sheer bolts and 70mm pistons, but does it clear
And if not making my own disc brake mounting plates but just the section that would need to be bolted to the axle and then these mounting plates scabbed to fit would add another 1,500 bucks to the cost Not sure this would add enough "easy fit" to the making of the mounting assembly for the caliper.
or
Still need a winch. If I can find the rest of the parts on this side of the country for the winch I already have then great! But since that is looking to be a hard find, I have been considering a 24 Volt 25K Sherpa Stallion winch for $1999. I would mount it on top of the frame rails in-front of the grill out of harms way. This would make me consider change some items for my charging system, 8D batteries can only take in about 60 amps charge anyway so the stock 60 amp generator should be fine, but having a one wire 33si that does 100 amps wouldn't hurt my feelings any when the draw of the winch at max would be 210 amps at 24V.
I did pick up a remote brake fluid reservoir for my master cylinder and a cool valve setup for the front sprag disconnect to freewheel the front axle. I'll install those when it is a bit warmer out.
Still considering the big jump to a Hydromax brake system. My notes on getting this done are here in an old thread I had found, I put my notes on how the system would be installed on my M813 if I jump into it. The thread is a good long read for info on how the Hydromax system works.
Hydro-Max Brake Assist *pics added* (long read)
Hi Rusty, I will back up and list what I have, then my ultimate goal... On my M135 I have acquired the following: B700 Rotors F550 Calipers HydroMax master. I will be keeping the 4 15306 brake wheel cylinder brakes on the rear as stock. Ultimate goal...
www.steelsoldiers.com
I'm going to put a copy of my notes here, for safe keeping and editing here rather than on that thread.
. Hydro max 2" piston unit with 50/50 proportioning and a 24V booster. There are models with a pressure differential switch to notify a warning light letting you know there is a problem, and it has a low level brake fluid sensor. I am not sure I care for either of the options but the proportioning is needed.
Hydro-Max Brake System Backup Motor, 24V w/ Single Threaded Stud Connection and 2 Replacement Seals
The Bosch Hydro-Max brake system operates off of power steering pump pressure, and has an electric backup motor to supply you with brake assistance in case the engine dies. The Hydro-Max has come OE on most medium trucks since the mid 80's, that aren't full air-brake, including school buses...
. Firewall mount Wilwood pedal assembly or similar (I would be getting the double peddle 7:1 mechanical advantage unit and using the 2nd peddle to install a hydraulic clutch assembly which would remove the "flex play" out of the stock linkage that annoys me when wheeling when the body and frame flex independent of each other. I need to verify the Hydromax booster will be able to bolt on the firewall side of the peddle, I haven't been able to find a bolt patten layout for the Hydromax boosters... so this could change.
Peddle pair link:
Clutch Master Cylinder link:
Clutch Slave Cylinder link:
This Clutch slave cylinder has only a 1.36" Stroke, I may need more than that... Will look into it.
. Flexible brake line hoses from proportioning valve/or MC to frame rails as this M813 flexes like no other and the lines cannot be hard lined down to the frame.
. Trailer brake mod to keep trailer brake function if I actually ever get a trailer. I already have a hand operated trailer air brake arm, which is intended to be mounted on steering column. Since I see no other sensible/affordable easy to install options this is all I think I would need.
.15lb Residual pressure valves for the brake lines if using drums still and 2lb for disc brakes.
On my M813 I would totally want at the same time to swap to disc brakes. All dreaming here. From what I have researched the F750 10 stud discs with the 4 piston calipers look like a solid fit. To do this mod I would flip my rear hubs, run long lug nut studs through the disc brake, then through the hub. I would then bolt/weld some caliper mounting plates to the axles. This way the disc and caliper will be tucked up inside the wheel and out of harms way.
A bonus from flipping the hub, is my rig with HEMTT wheels on all 6 tires are inset in the rear. Normally people put them on just the front axle to keep 16.00R20 tires from hitting quite so much on the steering box cover due to their 1 1/2 or 2" offset from stock 5 ton rims, but if you run them on all 6 the fronts are offset out from stock and the rears are inset from stock giving the rig a narrower rear tracking of the tires. I would prefer a wide track in the rear as well so flipping the hub is desired which will make the track width same front and rear but being wider by that 1 1/2 or 2" offest the HEMTT wheels give.
END OF HYDROBRAKE THREAD.
From the Disc Brake Conversion thread, one of our SS members pulled some info that was helpful which I was drawing from:
Here is the link to his thread:
Disc Brake Conversion
I am looking at swapping my 5 ton axles over to disc brakes. After doing a lot of research on this forum and on the internet in general I was able to figure out which rotors/pads/calipers I needed for the swap. On an old thread I saw someone say that instead of using F550 calipers that it would...
www.steelsoldiers.com
This is the rotor that I think would be best to run, Two apparent sources:
Centric 120.79016 Disc Brake Rotor + Cross Reference | FinditParts
Centric 120.79016 Centric Premium Brake Rotor ✓ Order now for same-day shipping on eligible purchases from FinditParts.com, America's online marketplace for heavy duty parts.
www.finditparts.com
NAPA Premium Brake Rotor NB 4886839 | Buy Online - NAPA Auto Parts
Buy NAPA Premium Brake Rotor - NB 4886839 online from NAPA Auto Parts Stores. Get deals on automotive parts, truck parts and more.
www.napaonline.com
This is the stud that I believe will be long enough to go through the rotor, the spindle and then through the HEMTT wheel I don't have one of the rotors to see what the stud shoulder size is but I think it is the same as the 5 ton. I am guessing I would finally need to buy the correct wheel nuts that sit inset into the wheel when doing this too. I havn't checked the knurl size so these two parts may need revising.
Need left and right versions.
This is the caliper that appears to be the best choice, 4 piston, plate mountable, 6 sheer bolts and 70mm pistons, but does it clear
LH / RH Disc Brake Caliper w/ Phenolic Piston for Ford F650 F750 2009-2013 2015 | eBay
Ford F750 2015 All Engine Left with 70 mm Piston, Rear Mount Caliper. Ford F750 2015 All Engine Right with 70 mm Piston, Forward Mount Caliper. Ford F750 2009-2013 All Engine Left with 70 mm Piston, Rear Mount Caliper.
www.ebay.com
And if not making my own disc brake mounting plates but just the section that would need to be bolted to the axle and then these mounting plates scabbed to fit would add another 1,500 bucks to the cost Not sure this would add enough "easy fit" to the making of the mounting assembly for the caliper.
For 2016-2019, 2021-2023 Ford F750 Brake Caliper Bracket Motorcraft 52373XX | eBay
2016-2019, 2021-2023 Ford F750. Notes: Disc Brake Caliper Bracket -- With 8,500 Lb. Front Axle. Ensure Proper FitTo confirm that this part fits your vehicle, enter your vehicle's Year, Make, Model, Trim and Engine in the Compatibility Table.
www.ebay.com
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- 2,683
- 2,236
- 113
- Location
- Sunman Indiana
You might check with Roughstuff Specialties, they may be interested in developing some brackets as there could be a decent market if a common disc/caliper combo is readily available. I have no affiliation with them, other than have been buying their parts for years. Great prices for over the top US quality, always adding cool new products, including generic weld on caliper brackets, and IIRC they a vet owned!Bought two 8D batteries to ensure cold starts are solid.
Still need a winch. If I can find the rest of the parts on this side of the country for the winch I already have then great! But since that is looking to be a hard find, I have been considering a 24 Volt 25K Sherpa Stallion winch for $1999. I would mount it on top of the frame rails in-front of the grill out of harms way. This would make me consider change some items for my charging system, 8D batteries can only take in about 60 amps charge anyway so the stock 60 amp generator should be fine, but having a one wire 33si that does 100 amps wouldn't hurt my feelings any when the draw of the winch at max would be 210 amps at 24V.
I did pick up a remote brake fluid reservoir for my master cylinder and a cool valve setup for the front sprag disconnect to freewheel the front axle. I'll install those when it is a bit warmer out.
Still considering the big jump to a Hydromax brake system. My notes on getting this done are here in an old thread I had found, I put my notes on how the system would be installed on my M813 if I jump into it. The thread is a good long read for info on how the Hydromax system works.
Hydro-Max Brake Assist *pics added* (long read)
Hi Rusty, I will back up and list what I have, then my ultimate goal... On my M135 I have acquired the following: B700 Rotors F550 Calipers HydroMax master. I will be keeping the 4 15306 brake wheel cylinder brakes on the rear as stock. Ultimate goal...www.steelsoldiers.com
I'm going to put a copy of my notes here, for safe keeping and editing here rather than on that thread.
. Hydro max 2" piston unit with 50/50 proportioning and a 24V booster. There are models with a pressure differential switch to notify a warning light letting you know there is a problem, and it has a low level brake fluid sensor. I am not sure I care for either of the options but the proportioning is needed.
Hydro-Max Brake System Backup Motor, 24V w/ Single Threaded Stud Connection and 2 Replacement Seals
The Bosch Hydro-Max brake system operates off of power steering pump pressure, and has an electric backup motor to supply you with brake assistance in case the engine dies. The Hydro-Max has come OE on most medium trucks since the mid 80's, that aren't full air-brake, including school buses...
. Firewall mount Wilwood pedal assembly or similar (I would be getting the double peddle 7:1 mechanical advantage unit and using the 2nd peddle to install a hydraulic clutch assembly which would remove the "flex play" out of the stock linkage that annoys me when wheeling when the body and frame flex independent of each other. I need to verify the Hydromax booster will be able to bolt on the firewall side of the peddle, I haven't been able to find a bolt patten layout for the Hydromax boosters... so this could change.
Peddle pair link:
Clutch Master Cylinder link:
Clutch Slave Cylinder link:
This Clutch slave cylinder has only a 1.36" Stroke, I may need more than that... Will look into it.
. Flexible brake line hoses from proportioning valve/or MC to frame rails as this M813 flexes like no other and the lines cannot be hard lined down to the frame.
. Trailer brake mod to keep trailer brake function if I actually ever get a trailer. I already have a hand operated trailer air brake arm, which is intended to be mounted on steering column. Since I see no other sensible/affordable easy to install options this is all I think I would need.
.15lb Residual pressure valves for the brake lines if using drums still and 2lb for disc brakes.
On my M813 I would totally want at the same time to swap to disc brakes. All dreaming here. From what I have researched the F750 10 stud discs with the 4 piston calipers look like a solid fit. To do this mod I would flip my rear hubs, run long lug nut studs through the disc brake, then through the hub. I would then bolt/weld some caliper mounting plates to the axles. This way the disc and caliper will be tucked up inside the wheel and out of harms way.
A bonus from flipping the hub, is my rig with HEMTT wheels on all 6 tires are inset in the rear. Normally people put them on just the front axle to keep 16.00R20 tires from hitting quite so much on the steering box cover due to their 1 1/2 or 2" offset from stock 5 ton rims, but if you run them on all 6 the fronts are offset out from stock and the rears are inset from stock giving the rig a narrower rear tracking of the tires. I would prefer a wide track in the rear as well so flipping the hub is desired which will make the track width same front and rear but being wider by that 1 1/2 or 2" offest the HEMTT wheels give.
END OF HYDROBRAKE THREAD.
From the Disc Brake Conversion thread, one of our SS members pulled some info that was helpful which I was drawing from:
Here is the link to his thread:
Disc Brake Conversion
I am looking at swapping my 5 ton axles over to disc brakes. After doing a lot of research on this forum and on the internet in general I was able to figure out which rotors/pads/calipers I needed for the swap. On an old thread I saw someone say that instead of using F550 calipers that it would...www.steelsoldiers.com
This is the rotor that I think would be best to run, Two apparent sources:
Centric 120.79016 Disc Brake Rotor + Cross Reference | FinditParts
Centric 120.79016 Centric Premium Brake Rotor ✓ Order now for same-day shipping on eligible purchases from FinditParts.com, America's online marketplace for heavy duty parts.
NAPA Premium Brake Rotor NB 4886839 | Buy Online - NAPA Auto Parts
Buy NAPA Premium Brake Rotor - NB 4886839 online from NAPA Auto Parts Stores. Get deals on automotive parts, truck parts and more.
This is the stud that I believe will be long enough to go through the rotor, the spindle and then through the HEMTT wheel I don't have one of the rotors to see what the stud shoulder size is but I think it is the same as the 5 ton. I am guessing I would finally need to buy the correct wheel nuts that sit inset into the wheel when doing this too. I havn't checked the knurl size so these two parts may need revising.
Need left and right versions.
This is the caliper that appears to be the best choice, 4 piston, plate mountable, 6 sheer bolts and 70mm pistons, but does it clear
LH / RH Disc Brake Caliper w/ Phenolic Piston for Ford F650 F750 2009-2013 2015 | eBay
Ford F750 2015 All Engine Left with 70 mm Piston, Rear Mount Caliper. Ford F750 2015 All Engine Right with 70 mm Piston, Forward Mount Caliper. Ford F750 2009-2013 All Engine Left with 70 mm Piston, Rear Mount Caliper.www.ebay.com
And if not making my own disc brake mounting plates but just the section that would need to be bolted to the axle and then these mounting plates scabbed to fit would add another 1,500 bucks to the cost Not sure this would add enough "easy fit" to the making of the mounting assembly for the caliper.
orFor 2016-2019, 2021-2023 Ford F750 Brake Caliper Bracket Motorcraft 52373XX | eBay
2016-2019, 2021-2023 Ford F750. Notes: Disc Brake Caliper Bracket -- With 8,500 Lb. Front Axle. Ensure Proper FitTo confirm that this part fits your vehicle, enter your vehicle's Year, Make, Model, Trim and Engine in the Compatibility Table.www.ebay.com
- 325
- 878
- 93
- Location
- Utah, Murray, United States
I feel bad as I haven't had a chance to take the BOT wheeling yet.After getting a very close up inspection of the torque rod ends when doing the lockers, I was really wanting to weld some safety plates on the for a just in case bad luck tries to visit.
But as far as on road behavior, i noticed no change, no popping or anything odd. But for insurance I did get the sprag kit for front axle engagement/disengagement intended for a M35 that was for sale in the SS parts for sale area, just for the long term wear on my rig.